What Should I Look For In A Schutzhund Club?

[Luvs]

My daughter and I went and met with the local Schutzhund club Tuesday night. We are thinking about joining the club, but I am not really sure what to look for when thinking about joining a Schutzhund club.

I really want to do at least the tracking and obedience. I am still unsure about the protection portion with Akasha. We won't do any bitework with Keil since he is a therapy dog and can't do therapy work if he does any bite work. What I really liked about the members of this club is that they were very supportive about us just wanting to do obedience and tracking with Keil. I also really like the fact that they train all year long.

What are some things that I should look for as far as knowing if this club knows what they are doing or not? It has been 16 years since I have done Schutzhund and I have really forgotten most of what I learned At the time it was just getting started up here and I was not really impressed with the person working our dogs, so we quit.

The club we went to Tuesday night is a small group that meets in our area once a week and they have a larger group that meets in Anchorage 2x a week. So, we have the opportunity to train with them 3x a week when we can. The trainers have titled several dogs and they have Rotties, GS, and Mals of their own that they train and have titled. There are quite a few Rotties in the club which I am happy about. What I really liked about this group was how welcome they made us feel and how they in no way made us feel pressured to even think about doing bite work with Keil. They totally understood why we didn't want to do it with him, which was nice. Someone else I recently spoke to was not so nice and understanding, which is why we WON"T be training with him. The trainers of this club are a husband and wife team. One thing I noticed is that the husband worked his wifes dog. Is that ok to do? Is it ok to put on a sleeve and work your dog or another family members dog?

Is it too confusing for a dog to do both AKC obedience and Schutzhund at the same time? I know that there are some differences, but I would love to be able to do both.

What we are planning on doing is joining and doing the tracking and obedience and watching the bitework before making my decision with Akasha.
We did get her out when they were working with the puppies to let her watch and see how she would react. She went crazy wanting to join in, so they played with her with the rag and she LOVED it. That is as far as I am going to go with her until I have seen more of what they do. I am not in a hurry to do bitework with Akasha and want to make sure that they know what they are doing before I get started.

I would really appreciate any suggestions or advice anyone may have

[laurlitt]

It is great that you found a club that is supportive of your needs. I'd say you're off to a good start with that, especially if you're looking to do TR and OB only (or at first).

Sounds like Akasha wants to play the game and letting her play around with the tug/rag when they do puppy work shouldn't be a problem either!!!

Originally Posted by Luvs

Is it ok to put on a sleeve and work your dog or another family members dog?

Absolutely, but there are always exceptions to every rule. If it is a young dog/puppy and you're working in prey (all fun) then I see no conflict. If the helper is an authority figure in the household it may be harder for the dog to work confidently with the helper. If the dog is working in defense or the helper needs to start putting pressure on the dog it may be unfair to the dog to expect them to be obedient to the helper in the household.

My husband has done a lot of work w/ my 2 yo female. It has mostly been done in prey. When he has put some pressure on her she seems a bit unsure what to do (sort of like... I'm not suppose to be mean to my dad), but when she's in front of another helper who does the same thing (or more pressure)... She turns it on and says "Bring it On"...

So I think a better answer may be, it depends on the level of training the dog is at and the temperment/genetics of the dog.

[Muckdogs]

Originally Posted by laurlitt

It is great that you found a club that is supportive of your needs. I'd say you're off to a good start with that, especially if you're looking to do TR and OB only (or at first).

Sounds like Akasha wants to play the game and letting her play around with the tug/rag when they do puppy work shouldn't be a problem either!!!



Absolutely, but there are always exceptions to every rule. If it is a young dog/puppy and you're working in prey (all fun) then I see no conflict. If the helper is an authority figure in the household it may be harder for the dog to work confidently with the helper. If the dog is working in defense or the helper needs to start putting pressure on the dog it may be unfair to the dog to expect them to be obedient to the helper in the household.

My husband has done a lot of work w/ my 2 yo female. It has mostly been done in prey. When he has put some pressure on her she seems a bit unsure what to do (sort of like... I'm not suppose to be mean to my dad), but when she's in front of another helper who does the same thing (or more pressure)... She turns it on and says "Bring it On"...

So I think a better answer may be, it depends on the level of training the dog is at and the temperment/genetics of the dog.

Great analysis. I do a lot of work with my own dogs. For my male, he can take all of the pressure I can hand out and give it right back. But, my female, she is very, very soft to me (but an absolute bitch to others) and I can barely get her to take the sleeve when I'm wearing it. Consequently, I keep all of her work between us in prey.

As far as the OP goes, I think that its great that they have a nice club. One bit of advice I can give is to try to look a club where you can learn something. By that I mean, you want to find folks who realize that eveyone that comes through the gates is not seasoned and needs help. You want to find people willing to teach, explain and demonstrate. But, remember this as well. You also have to make the efforts to learn, practice and train on your own, perfecting what you have been taught. From my perspective, I like to see enthusiastic members that come to club and can show a genuine interest in the sport. Maybe things like, "Hey, I was reading this article on ...., what do you think", or "I got this dvd from ... and noticed that ..., do you think that's a good way to go?" From a trainers perspective, it can get very frustrating at times when members think that joining a club is like getting a few people to train their dog and no real effort is made to participate, share, or learn.

I also think its great that the op's new club is receptive to things other than bitework. Some clubs seem to concentrate so much on bitework, new people wonder if the sport is anything but bitework. A club should be about camaraderie and community. Everyone should chip in where and when they can, whether it is helping set up the field, being part of the group, getting equipment when needed, helping with dogs, bringing out water for the helpers, whatever. Remember, if you are serious, you will be spending a lot of time with these people and building some strong bonds. Ideally, you should feel that some, not necessarily all, of the other club members are your best friends. that to me is what you should look for in a club.

Of course, you also have a responsibility to your dog as well. You have to self educate somewhat to be able to differentiate at some level what is good or bad for your dog. I think that mos tfolks who have been in clubs have had some bad experiences at one time or another. Read articles, read books, watch videos, post on forums, try to learn the lingo about drives, nerves, etc.. but go into it with some semblance of right and wrong. Don't be afraid to ask questions or object, because after all, it is your dog. If you think something is screwy, put ont he brakes and ask questions. Good trainers and helpers should be willing to take the time to answer. Conversely, I would stay away from those that train with blinders on and its their way or the highway.

Good luck, take it slow, soak it all in and most importantly, have fun.

[Skip]

Also, it's nice to have a club that has scheduled times when bitework actually starts. I've been to a couple clubs where bitework is supposed to start at 6:00 pm, but then after all the people get thru socializing it doesn't start somedays until 7, other days until 8:00. A friendly atmosphere is great but if you have to drive any distance at all to your club it really helps if they can keep the times consistent.

[Luvs]

Thank you for your input everyone. We have decided to go ahead and join the club. My daughter has spent several hours on the phone with one of the trainers the past two days is very happy with what she has heard. I am really impressed that she was willing to spend so much time on the phone with my daughter answering her questions and explaining things to her.

My daughter went to a seminar several months ago and did not have a good experience. She learned a very valuable lesson at the seminar about letting someone take her dog and work him (which is something that WON'T happen again). Keil is a soft boy and is VERY handler sensitive and does not do well in a prong. At the seminar a prong was put on him (at the suggestion of the instructor) and he was worked by the instructor and ended up screaming and hiding behind my daughter when she got him back. Not to get off topic but, both the husband and wife of the new club we want to join were there so they know first hand that Keil is a soft boy and have been discussing training methods for Keil that don't involve compulsion.

I totally agree that if we join this club we need to be active members and help out, as well as doing alot of traing on our own. Which we are more than willing to do. We already train daily on our own but would be very happy to help out with things at the club. I have already been doing alot of reading and trying to learn all I could for the past few months, long before we ever decided to check out this club. I wanted to make sure that Schutzhund is something that I wanted to get involved in again. It has been so long since I have done any Schutzhund I am pretty much a total novice, since I am sure I have forgotten more than I ever knew, besides I am sure that many things have changed since the 80's Funny how some things just come back naturally tho. When I got Akasha out to do the rag work with the other puppies I automatically switched my leash so that I had it wrapped around behind me giving me better leverage to hold her. I hadn't even realized I had done it until the trainer mentioned that she could tell I had done this before.

Thank you again for taking the time to respond to this thread. I am sure that I will have MANY more questions for you in the future I am really looking forward to becoming a member of this club. I definately think I will learn alot, make some great friends, and hopefully give something back to the club as well