to leak, or not to leak....

[Mattweiser]

this thread is way under-used... so here is a discussion starter:

Do any of you have dogs that bleed drive (whining, teeth clattering, lip licking, etc..)??

If so, do you allow it? tolerate it? stop it?

[samanthac]

I always understood that this was a sign of conflict. If that's the case, then its a training/miscommunication issue between the handler and the dog.

[Judi W]

I think it usually means that the dog has not matured into the level of the work.

[samanthac]

Thanks for the clarification.

[Mattweiser]

no.. it is not a lack of maturation, as I have seen many dogs do it.. many well into their years (5, 6, etc)...

it is typically a sign of excessive drive... usually in conjunction with capping..

[Mattweiser]

it is not something you typically see in Rottweilers... the closest you get is usually the trembling when they are in a down, and awaiting a release to a bite....

you see it more in higher-drive breeds (shepherds, apbt, etc).. I was just wondering if anyone here had much experience with it...

:)

[lblax]

Originally posted by Mattweiser
it is not something you typically see in Rottweilers... the closest you get is usually the trembling when they are in a down, and awaiting a release to a bite....

you see it more in higher-drive breeds (shepherds, apbt, etc).. I was just wondering if anyone here had much experience with it...

:)

exactly! you see it in dogs that you dont constantly have to build drive in....... we have several dogs in our club that do this,they are in overdrive all the time almost too much drive in a couple of them. in my opinion it is easier to calm them then to have to build them up all the time...we work all of these dogs calmly in ob.... and basically keep the reward hidden weve had a few close calls for masctectimies(excuse the spelling) because of tugs under the arm .......

[Judi W]

Actually, I did not mean maturation as in age, but to the work in that the dog grows into the job. He knows he is going to get to do the work and what the drill is. I don't think of it as lowered drive, but as a control of the anxiety to move.

[Mattweiser]

Originally posted by lblax
...a few close calls for masctectimies(excuse the spelling) because of tugs under the arm .......

LMAO!!!

gotta love those close calls!!!

Larry,

what I was wondering, is ... do you allow the "extra" behavior, or do you guys actively attempt to stop it??

[Mattweiser]

Originally posted by Judi W
Actually, I did not mean maturation as in age, but to the work in that the dog grows into the job. He knows he is going to get to do the work and what the drill is. I don't think of it as lowered drive, but as a control of the anxiety to move.

Judi,

these dogs that I am referring to, tend to make more nose, the better they understand their job.. it is the anticipation that causes the "leaking"...

[valdes43]

I have no idea what a leaky dog is. :)

[Skip]

Originally posted by valdes43
I have no idea what a leaky dog is. :)

I think it is the name they gave to the remains that was discovered of the first prehistoric dog.

[Judi W]

ok guys,

gottcha.

I think one of the reasons you won't (shouldn't) see a lot of on this issue with the Rottweilers is that they are supposed to be calm workers................

[Mojave's Mom]

I don't know much about SchH work in the slightest...but I do know that our male Belgian Sheepdog would be a good candidate for it. He can not stand sitting around watching other dogs work (OB or Agility) and having to wait his turn. Once it is his turn, however, he works beautifully...great attention, speed, accuracy.

His "method" is barking and whining.... Much to my discontent If he's waiting in a crate or xpen, he will scream his head off until it's his turn (we've been working the "quiet" command as AKC sports won't tolerate a dog like him sitting on the sidelines). When it finally IS his turn it's amazing the difference in him. Mouth shuts up, body is still rushing to go, but controlled.

I gotta hand it to those of you who work this type of breed.....most days he has me pulling out my hair with his amount of energy

[alexav]

We have a Mal in our club that is was barely under control when the stimulus of a decoy was present. In other situations the dog is great.

She teeth chatters/clacks, and when overstimulated will nip her handler. Ouch! This gal was pretty bruised up during the Ivan Balabanov seminar and was about at her wits end.

There was talk of e-collars, alpha rolls, nose whacking, etc.

My idea was to ask the dog for a calm sit and eye contact to "ask permission" of the handler to charge the decoy.

At first it was only an instant with perfect timing on the handler's part. Sit+glance up= release.
Due to consistency in perfect timing, this dog now sits fairly calmly at her handler's side, stares up at her, waiting for the release. No more nipping or clacking. I think it was about the dog "knowing" what was expected and that the dog had the power to initiate the wanted action...

Perhaps, through bad timing on the handler's part, dogs will associate one of these unwanted behaviors with the release to go do the activity they so badly want to do and thus the behavior is rewarded?