It happened again :(

[Weily4Life]

Originally Posted by moondog

Since you do not even have a diagnosis yet, I would not be experimenting with alternative therapies without the help of a vet.....you may do more harm than good.

I concur, I posted the herbal and homeopathic options because of her interest. I am the type of person that feeds on and collects as much information on a given topic to know what possibilities exist. Just figured paige may be similar that way.

A diagnosis first is essential before starting any type of treatment whether it be conventional or alternative to rule out toxins, metabolic diseases, worms, tumors, direct damage to the brain, electrolyte imbalances, a malfunctioning kidney or liver.

Paige,
I double checked the rules and guidelines for posting. To give you specifics of the herbal remedies and such would be copywright infringement so cannot give you the details. If you are still interested, the book I referred to it Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide to Natural Health for Dogs & Cats Third Edition Revised and Updated, c2005 by Richard H. Pitcairn and Susan H. Pitcairn. Thirty yrs ago he discovered homeopathic medicine. He converted his practice to the use of homeopathy and nutrition and in the past few years turned his attention to training other veterinarians in "the system of healing".

[Nishasmom]

Thank you all; don't worry I wont give ANY meds (herbal or not) unless under a vets care/recommendation .

I did talk with the breeder a few minutes ago (I sent her a link to the video); after watching the video, she also thinks seizures. (the rapid eye movement is what clued her in).

[Nishasmom]

Originally Posted by mamamia1

What was Nisha treated with for Giardia???? I found the following side effects for Metronidazole [Flagyl] which is commonly used to treat Giardia.

SIDE EFFECTS: Metronidazole is a valuable antibiotic and is generally well tolerated with appropriate use. Minor side effects include nausea, headaches, loss of appetite, a metallic taste, and rarely a rash. "Serious side effects of metronidazole are rare. Serious side effects include seizures and damage of nerves resulting in numbness and tingling of extremities (peripheral neuropathy). Metronidazole should be stopped if these symptoms appear."

Yes she was on Metronidazole, the vet said she was on safe dosages and it shouldn't have had an effect on her. I will bring this up with her again.

[mamamia1]

Just a shot in the dark with the Flagyl idea, but those serious side effects sure could explain Nishas "fits". I sure hope you find some answers tomorrow.... Good Luck and Take Care!

P.S. I just found a chart with the suggested dosage Dogs: 11.5 mg/lb twice daily for 5 days. Hopefully Nishas dose fell into those parameters. Again, just a shot in the dark, it has been quite some time since she was on the meds.

[FilosFolks]

Paige,

What about vertigo?? Her equilibrium??

Just today I heard about a lab that had his baby hairs inside his ear drums causing him to have certain episodes.

Could something like nasal drip cause something like vertigo in dogs as it does in humans?

Ailee

[TrinaJ]

Paige,

Just wanted to wish you all the best tomorrow at the vet, hope he/she can figure out what is causing Nisha's episodes and can either fix them or get the problem under control.,

Thinking of you!

~*hug*~

Trina

[Alura]

I just now read through the whole thread and my thoughts and prayers are with you.

In terms of "natural" remedies, I wonder what your vet may think about "rescue remedy". It may help calm her down a bit regardless of the cause....just a though.

Good luck!

[damp]

Originally Posted by Terri Lambert

It looks like your Nisha is having what is called focale(spelling?) seizures. I work at a vet and have seen this a few times from mild to severe. Sometimes these dogs go into full blown seizures some do not. What is the big give away is the mouth chomping, the eyes doing weird things and the foaming at the mouth. Another name for these seizures are facile seizures. Please show this video to your vet if you can.

If it was a human I would report the seizure as: A partielle (focale) complex seizure!

Originally Posted by Nishasmom

Damp, what do you mean by stressed?

She plays like crazy and is so care free at all other times .

I was talking about what I saw in the video. By stressed I mean: Totally confused, "half" unconscious, she does not know what she do and why...

[Nishasmom]

Okay, just got back from the vet. I saw a different one this time (the office has two); this vet is supposedly more experienced.

As soon as she saw the video, she said it was definitely a seizure of some sort.

Her first course of action is a Bile test. Supposedly liver shunts are one of the most common causes of seizures in young dogs. Something about the toxins building up in the blood/brain. I just got home, so I haven't had time to research it yet. The test has to be done while fasting, so she couldn't get it done today. She will go in tomorrow morning though.

She told me if the bile test comes back negative, she would start Nisha on Phenobarbatol (sp?). We will keep her on it for around 6 months, then see what happens.

I will let you know the results tomorrow! If she does have a shunt, she will need surgery. Does anyone have experience with shunts? She also mentioned if it was a shunt eating would "trigger" a seizure. Most of her "episodes" have been at night, after a meal.

[Nishasmom]

Damp, thanks for clearing that up, I was confused by your first post. I thought you were saying it is behavioral; relating to the way we "train" her.

[mamamia1]

NISHASMOM: I read something with regards to FLAGYL and the liver as well.

Metronidazole and possible liver damage

Question: Have you ever heard of Flagyl affecting the liver enzyme levels?

Answer: Metronidazole (Flagyl Rx) is metabolized primarily by the liver. It
sometimes causes liver damage or makes existing liver damage worse. This is
thought to be a reversible effect which usually will resolve with
withdrawal of the medication.
Mike Richards, DVM

"It may not have caused damage but it may have tipped the scales if she had a preexisting condition."

[fostermom]

I agree with the poster who mentioned focal seizures...please check out this link, particularly the section that describes complex focal seizures:
Understanding Epilepsy

Complex focal seizures originate in the areas of the brain that control emotions and behavior (the temporal lobes) and are sometimes called psychomotor seizures. When a seizure begins in one of these areas, the animal's consciousness is altered and they behave bizarrely. They may run uncontrollably, engage in senseless, repetitive behavior, or rarely fly into a rage. Other times, we see bodily functions affected and the pet may have diarrhea or vomit. Following a typical generalized seizure, unusual behavior (post-ictal behavior) is common and may go on for hours. Complex focal seizures, like other types of seizures, are typically very brief.

Most often, an animal behaving aggressively or acting strangely has a behavioral problem or some other reason for the change in behavior. If, however, these changes occur as discrete episodes, and the pet also has a generalized seizure, we can be sure that this is a complex focal seizure and treat it accordingly. People with complex focal seizures may experience hallucinations. Some dogs have episodes of fly-biting where they appear to be biting at imaginary flies around their head. Some of these may be complex focal seizures although we cannot tell for sure.

[Nishasmom]

mamamia1: thanks for the info, I just called the vet to remind her about this.

Also, we recently switched foods (maybe 1 month ago) I am not sure what the protein percentages were on the old food she was on, I will have to look it up. The new food is 21%; supposedly dogs with liver shunts cannot handle high protein diets. If this food has a higher protein than the other foods we were feeding, it could have "pushed" her liver over the edge. This could also explain why we have a hard time keeping weight on her.

Fostermom: that sounds like the type of seizure Nisha is having. I thought complex PARTIAL seizure, but the complex focal seizure seems to match too. Do you know the difference of the two, or are they basically the same ?

[Ninasmom]

Nina has also reacted to flagyl - only she went lame in the back end and her nervous system almost shut down. She had been on it before and the vet was clueless that it could happen. I found out by doing a search here. Within 24 hours of taking her off though, it cleared up immediately.

[marianne]

Good luck tomorrow. You might want to ask your vet for a referral to a Neurologist. I have had a epileptic dog The video showed very focal signs. Phenobarbital (PB) was the first seizure meds we used. The Neuroglist added Potassiom bromide (KBR). The meds can control the seizures.

Believe me I know the feelings you are going thru.