Loose Stool

[rottnelmo]

You may remember that I just had a nasty scare with Elmo regarding throwing up and loose/bloody stools.

It has been about two weeks since and he seems to be doing well, however, when ever I try to switch him back to Cal. Natural Chicken and Rice from the blan diet (rice and beef) that he has been on his stools go back loose and runny, almost water. I am doing the switch slowly and he handles that well. Meaning that he handles a 1 cup or so of kibble in his rice and beef, stools are nice and formed, but as soon as I switch him back to straight kibble, stools go loose again. I have tried the taper off for about a week, went to straight kibble Sunday...loose runny stools. Tried again yesterday, straight kibble, loose runny stools. Back to rice and beef this morning, nice formed stools. What could the problem be???? Could it be an intolerance to his food now?

I have a call into the vet and am taking a stool sample tomorrow morning to try to get to the bottom of this.

Any ideas or suggestions? My poor puppers has been through WAY too much!

[MontanaRott]

Steven could not go back to the Cal Nat after we got him firmed up with I/D. He did the same thing, got runny all over again.So our vet suggested trying Natures Recipe Lamb and Rice, it says "Easily Digested" on the bag and is for dogs with gastric upset problems. So we got it finished out the I/D, mixing in the NR, and now he is on just the NR and is firm as ever. I guess the Cal Nat was just to rich for his system. Ask your vet about NR and see what he/she says.
Good luck it is a frustrating problem.

[rottnelmo]

Originally Posted by MontanaRott

Steven could not go back to the Cal Nat after we got him firmed up with I/D. So our vet suggested trying Natures Recipe lamb and rice, it says Easily Digested on the bag and is for dogs with gastric upset problems. So we got it finished out the I/D mixing in the NR and now he is on just the NR and is firm as ever. I guess the Cal Nat was just to rich for his system. Ask your vet about NR and see what he/she says.
Good luck it is a frustrating problem.

Whats I/D? Is that Science Diet I/D? I would prefer to stay away from ANYTHING Science Diet. I will ask about the NR tomorrow when I talk to her. I am thinking the same thing that he just cant tolerate the Cal Nat anymore. He has allergies to Corn and Wheat, so I have to be very careful what I feed him.

Yes, very frustrating...thank you for the tip and advice...

[MontanaRott]

Yes the i/d is a prescription diet by Science Diet that our vet had him go on for a couple of weeks as his system was a mess. It really firmed him up and then when we tried adding the CN back to his kibble slowly he would just go runny. So far so good with the NR. We also add a table spoon of Whole milk organic yogurt to his food for the enyzmes etc for his poor little gut.

[Judy Chrusch]

He may have an allergy to chicken so don't try anymore to get him back on his regular food, if he's doing well on the hamburg and rice keep him on that a little longer then try a brand w/o chicken or as Shirley said, a prescription food. None of us like feeding it but if it works for the dog that's what's important. Try California Natural Lamb and Rice, mix a little at a time with any food you introduce or have him put on a non allergic food which is z/d Ultra, it's the only food that works long term for Czar and he gets slimey bloody diarrhea as well on other foods. But if he's doing well on beef and rice and you've tried the other food and he gets diarrhea again then stop that all together. What may be good for one dog, may not be good for another.

Judy

[moondog]

It may feel like you're going slow, but you're going too fast for his intestinal system. It takes longer than you'd think for the insides to heal. When dogs suffer severe gastro injury, their body tends to develop sensitivities that behave like food allergies, although temporary.

Example: When my dog came down with her gastro illness, she could not tolerate rice at ALL. After 8 months and 4 diet changes due to intolerance of one thing or another, I tried rice again as a last resort. She had no intolerance and is still eating rice as her carb source 3 years later.

My suggestion is to give him more time - another month anyway - and then slowly and over the following month try introducing his kibble again. At ANY sign of intolerance, back up again...but it's better to go especially slow than to have him develop intestinal inflammation over and over by going too fast reintroducing the kibble.

[rottnelmo]

Originally Posted by MontanaRott

We also add a table spoon of Whole milk organic yogurt to his food for the enyzmes etc for his poor little gut.

What about a pro-biotic...is that the same thing?

[SABELLESMOM]

Our Cocker was allergic not only to chicken but beef as well. We did the whole route...ended up on CAL NATURAL LAMB & RICE. And, yes, we do add a tablespoon of NATURAL YOGURT to promote good stomach flora. We also add a scoop of organic KELP. It's helped him tremendously. Boosts the immune system, improves skin conditions. It helps the thyroid function properly, reduces stress, allergies, etc. I've even found pigment restored. www.kelpproductsofflorida.com Good luck!

[hcelsa]

Originally Posted by rottnelmo

What about a pro-biotic...is that the same thing?

A high quality probiotic is MUCH better than adding yogurt. To actually get a beneficial amount of probiotics from yogurt you'd have to feed very large quantities (and for many dogs yogurt can actually cause stomach upset)! I'd recommend a good quality, single source probiotic (powdered if possible) for healthy bacteria (according to our sports vet, holistic vet, and GP vet, acidophilus has shown the most beneficial effects on dogs with digestive upsets...all three of them recommend giving a single source probiotic rather than multi-source during times of stress). Here's a link to an excellent one: Probiotic

Also its important to remember that dogs can have allergies/reactions to seemingly harmless supplements (and in some cases different brands of the same supplement--after all, every dog is an individual), so it helps to remove all of that stuff for a few weeks and then start adding one thing in at a time so that you can be sure it isn't what is causing the reaction.

[moondog]

Originally Posted by hcelsa

A high quality probiotic is MUCH better than adding yogurt. To actually get a beneficial amount of probiotics from yogurt you'd have to feed very large quantities (and for many dogs yogurt can actually cause stomach upset)!

This is very good advice, especially for a dog like Elmo who is still in the recovery stage of a severe gastro upset. You'll get the benefit of beneficial bacteria without adding anything else to potentially have a reaction to and complicate things further.

Originally Posted by hcelsa

Also its important to remember that dogs can have allergies/reactions to seemingly harmless supplements (and in some cases different brands of the same supplement--after all, every dog is an individual), so it helps to remove all of that stuff for a few weeks and then start adding one thing in at a time so that you can be sure it isn't what is causing the reaction.

Also good advice. My dog will never be able to tolerate a commercial diet of any kind for this very reason....it is not possible to identify or isolate the offending agent when contained in a commercial food. Even with vitamin/mineral supplements I have to pay attention. When first introducing a supplement to balance her primary elimination diet, I tried several of the best human quality supplements only to have each one set her back a step. The one that ultimately agrees with her turns out to be a very generic human grade supplement, no frills attached. Something or a number of somethings contained in those higher priced supplements is not present in your everyday, run of the mill, economical vitamin/mineral supplements...and that is the one that works for her.

Also, when adding a new ingredient (supplement or otherwise), you need to give it some time before you'll be able to determine if it's tolerable. A dog may seem just fine for a few days and then develop a reaction to the new ingredient. I gave each new addition a minimum of 4-5 weeks before even thinking about adding anything else.

[MontanaRott]

Thanks for the link Becky, even though Stevie does fine with the organic yogurt if it will be more benificial for him to have the Probiotic I am willing to make that change. It was our holistic vet that recommended the yogurt.

[rottnelmo]

I feed a liquid Pro-biotic that I have been feeding Elmo for quiet some time. Here is the link to it Dyna-Pro

If you cant access the link:
Description:
Dyna-Pro is a biological feed additive designed to maximize digestive efficiency. Physical and psychological stress caused by travel, competition, breeding or treatment with antibiotics and some of the antiparasite products can dramatically disrupt a horse's metabolism by destroying or depleting the beneficial intestinal bacteria. These bacteria must produce all the enzymes necessary to convert feed into a form that the horse can use. The bacteria (microbes) also assist in vitamin production and help prevent harmful bacteria from entering and multiplying in the digestive tract. While other probiotic formulas on the market merely add one or more strains of beneficial bacteria, Dyna-Pro uses a fermentation extract which nourishes the natural bacteria and encourages them to reproduce and multiply.

Ingredients:
Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product Dehydrated, Water, Lactic Acid, Dried Kelp, Vitamin D Supplement, Folic Acid, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Supplement, Magnesium Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate and Iron Sulfate with Calcium Propionate, Sodium Benzoate and Phosphoric Acid as preservatives.

Directions:
Stressed, sick or rehabilitating horses: 6 ml (1/4 oz) per day
Foals, maintenance: 3 ml (1/8 oz) per day
Dyna-Pro may be added to the feed, put in the water, or drenched in the mouth.

Note: This one says that it is for horses, but is the exact same as the dog Pro, just comes in a bigger bottle that lasts longer.

I have had great luck with it and feed it daily. Its like American Express...I never leave home with out it.

[MontanaRott]

Thanks Beth, and good luck with Elmo.

[HerculesMomma]

Someone recommended to me that I go to the health food store and by the refrigerated kind of pro-biotics for Herc when he was trying to get past his problems with Giardia. I guess it's supposed to be better? That finally seemed to help Hercules get over the hump with his stools as the Natures Miracle brand probiotics weren't quite cutting it.

But in the end, while he was still on the CN Chicken and Rice, his stools were still too loose IMO. The vet thought he might have a touch of colitis after being treated for Giardia. Finally I switched his food to Innova, and his stools have been fabulous since then! I don't know why it made a difference to switch food, but it worked.

[moondog]

The probiotics I've purchased all recommend refrigerating after opening, even if they are kept on the shelf while sealed, and using within a limited period of time (mine says 90 days). I assume this is because the bacteria populations are perishable and using a fresh product that is kept refrigerated will slow their demise and get more good stuff in the dog.