not house trained at 5 months old!

[Hurricane]

I've searched for posts on crate training and house breaking,and found a little bit of help, but I have some more specific questions.

Hubby was totally against crate training, so we now have to replace the carpet before we sell the house and move in 6 months. Our only hope is that Oxy Clean will take up the stains. Hubby still will not allow me to buy a crate. Hurricane has made my bathroom his "den". We were both working, so Hurricane got into the habit of going wherever he happened to be standing when the need strikes. As a last resort, hubby was working nights and I was tired of cleaning the carpet every single day, so when I went to bed and couldn't watch the puppy, I closed the bathroom door. In 3 days, I noticed a dramatic difference! But, it's not all better. Hurricane still claims the bathroom as his, and I'm not using it for punishment. I will close him in there when I go to sleep, or leave the house, or am so busy with whatever that I can't watch him. But, we still have accidents. He will start to pee on the carpet, so I say "no" and he quits. I take him outside, but he won't ever finish peeing. He just sits down in the grass and chills. He's already done this twice this morning. He can sleep through the night without any fuss. The alarm clock goes off around 5 AM, then hubby hits snooze. Hurricane knows what the alarm means, so he gets whiny if hubby keeps hitting snooze. Hubby is proving much harder to train than the dog. ;-) But these accidents are putting me at my wits end. Sometmes, I know I need to take the puppy out because he starts sniffing around suspiciously. But, 9 times out of 10, he doesn't. He'll just be walking along and just stop and pee. The poopy accidents have quit altogether, I'm happy to say. I wish hubby would allow me to buy a real crate. I put water in with Hurricane, but no food. How can I get him to quit peeing on the carpet? I don't want to lock him in the bathroom except for playtime and potty time. BTW, I'm eagerly awaiting my idiot's guide!

PS-my older dog is so "well trained" that we went away overnight. Left on a Saturday morning and came home Sunday night, and he held it the entire time. He had run of the house, too.

[Joanne in NJ]

Hurricane,

I don't know how to phrase this- I'm sure to be blasted, but it's bothering me so here goes....

Your older dog went 36 hours without pottying? Housebreaking can sometimes be very ingrained, there's members here who's dogs developed bladder infections from holding it.

Couldn't someone come by to feed them and give them an opportunity to relieve themselves? Is kenneling them an option?

I had to do a transport this week and left my guys for about 12 hours. That's a longer time than they're used to waiting.

I was very uncomfortable about it, but I can not ask any of my neighbors to come let my guys out-especially with my one girls temperment becoming very iffy due to her cancer.

I'm sorry to be blunt and perhaps offensive, but I would cringe at leaving my guys unattented for a day, a night and a day.
Maybe I misunderstood the situation?

[Hurricane]

No, you didn't misunderstand.

When he was a puppy, we used a baby gate to keep him in the kitchen when we went to work. Whenever he couldn't hold it, he'd go in the kitchen, and never got in trouble for it. We assumed that when he had to go, he would do the same thing, and go in the kitchen. We were so shocked that he didn't use the bathroom! If I had had any idea things would have gone like that, I would never have considered the trip. Our neighbors were out of town that weekend and we really didn't know anyone else around here. We had even left the door to the garage open in case he felt more comfortable going in there. We are aware of the danger of UTI's (I get them myself periodically) and I can't imagine putting my dog through that! Tornado was very easy to potty train. You can bet if we can't take the dogs with us, next time we will find SOMEONE to come let them out for us, or we won't go! Now that I'm not working as much (Riding lessons twice a week) I'm home a lot more to help Hurricane learn where to go, and to let Tornado out, too.

[Teena]

Why is your husband so against crates? Does he think it's cruel to the dog? If so send me an e-mail, i lost a pup from not crating it. Believe me, crates are the way to go! Hope he doesn't have to learn the hard way, like i did. ;(
Teena

[Judi W]

http://www.rottweiler.net/rottie/smile.gif Well, this group gives pretty good dog behavior and trainig advice, but I don't know that it is reknown for marital/family counseling and that appears to be your need. Crating when your dog is unattended, and total attention to him when he is not. And absolutely, the crated time must be reasonable. You expressed that you allowed your other dog to go potty in the house when it was growing up. This is something I simply do not understand no matter what the circumstances.

Now, an alternative suggestion. What about a doggy door that goes into a secure, LOCKED, dog run?

[Hurricane]

That is an excellent idea! And we're moving in 6 months. He's going to Korea for a year, and I'm going to stay with a good friend. Army life sucks.

I've never been big on allowing dogs to potty in the house, but when Tornado (2yo) was a puppy, it was the only option we had. Of course, when Hurricane (5mo) spent the last 2 and a half months pottying wherever he felt like it and I was the one always cleaning it up, I finally got tired of it and decided to do my best to simulate crate training. Hubby thinks it's inhumane. I've told him that every breeder I've talked to reccomends it, he replies with, "Breeders don't care about the dogs, they just care that they obey." You can tell by that statement he's just not ready to listen to anything on the subject. However, it's me who is going to have to care for this dog by myself for a year, so I have totally taken over his training. Amazingly, when he has most of the day to run around now, he spends a good 7 to 8 hours sleeping in the bathroom with the door open. I only wish I could get him to sleep on a blanket or something! When is it OK for a dog to sleep in the bed?

[Judi W]

http://www.rottweiler.net/rottie/smile.gif Hummm, you mean that your husband prefers to see you cleaning up pee and poop than to see the dogs in a crate?????? Oops!

[Michael C.]

Well, a crate would definately solve your problem. To get your dog to go to the door to potty isn't very hard, but it takes alot of work on your part. Take your dog out every 1/2 hour regardless of wether he/she has to go potty. Say "go potty". When he goes, give lots of praise. Sometimes you might have to go outside and play the waiting game. Make sure you take hime out on a leash. After a few weeks of this, he should go to the door everytime he has to go. Make sure he goes potty before you put him in the bathroom also. It really seems like a hassle to take the dog out every 1/2 hour, but it beats cleaning up after them every day! Remember, this every 1/2 hour is only temporary and it should work fairly quick.

Mike

p.s. look up some articles on crate training to let your Hubby read and it might change his mind

[Hurricane]

I told him I'm going to start peeing on the carpet then see what he does to me! LOL

He didn't think that comment was very funny, but I sure did! He's going along with the bathroom thing, but he says I need to get the dog a night light! http://www.rottweiler.net/rottie/wink.gif I can see the usefulness of that. Cane is finally getting the idea of going potty on command. I realized I wasn't being very clear. I'd take the boys out and say "Go potty" and just leave it at that until they did. I started following Cane around and repeating myself as I did. By bedtime, he didn't even try to spend all night finding the right spot! He's really trying hard, I think. It seems like he hasn't figured out how to tell me when he needs to go, but it'll come, I'm sure. Thanks for all the help! Maybe by moving time, I'll have him ready to invest in a real crate! When Tornado was little, he used to sleep in the cat crate. It was so funny watching him and the kitty trying to share it! The more I observe, the more natural it seems. I'm sure hubby will see the light eventually. In the meantime, I do what I can. http://www.rottweiler.net/rottie/smile.gif

[Teena]

Your husband needs some serious information about crate training. It is NOT just about making the dog mind. It's for the dog's OWN WELL BEING & protection.
*sigh* I really don't like going into this. I had a beautiful loving gentle pup. He was 3 months old. A real cutie, that stole everyone's heart when they laid eyes on him. I like your husband Thought it was cruel to crate him. So, when i was gone i would leave him to raom in our fenced backyard & the garage.
Guess what, there a hundreds of every objects laying around your house that can be a DANGER to your pup. Would u think an ordinary plastic drinking cup would be a threat to your dog's safely? No, neither did I. He got the cup stuck on his head one day while i was gone grocery shopping. He was dead when i returned home. How would you like coming home to that some day? I was heartbroken!!! I still miss my tender little Ozzie.
If you care about your pup, don't wait, RUN out and buy a BIG wire crate. That way they can see all around them & really they don't mind it. Unless you abuse it by leaving them in there alot.
Pupies are like small children. If you can't watch them then you confine them. Would you leave a 2 year old child have free run of your house? No, why< because they might hurt themselves. Same thing for a pup.
No, i'm not a trainer or professional dog handler. I'm just an average housewife, that LOVES her pup.
An added bonus to crate training is, it makes potty training soooooooo much easier too.
We are retired Air Force, so i can relate to the lifestyle.
Good Luck!
Teena

[Chantal]

I have a 7 month old Rottie that was trained in about 2 weeks. We got her when she was 9 weeks. We said "NO" when she started going inside and took her outside and praised her when she did it in the right spot. We also used a crate. This makes them learn to hold it. We have a very large crate and at first we put boxes in the back, so she did not have the whole area. THey might go potty in the back, and sleep in the front. Get a book on crate training and let your husband read it. Another book I've recommended to others is The Art of Raising A Puppy. Very simple reading, you could read it in a day. This explains why crate training is important, and deals with housebreaking issues, and lots of other things. Good Luck. Ask your husband, would he rather see the dog in a crate, or at the pound, because your sick of cleaning up after it???

[AngelBunny]

Hurricane:

Since your dog isn't housetrained in the old house, how does your husband expect your dog to behave in the new house? Let me be the first to tell him--the dog will behave in the new house just the way he did in the old house--by using it as a latrine. What will your husband say the first time he does this? If he gets angry, it better be at himself because it's his fault that the dog is doing what he's been doing.

YOU AND YOUR HUSBAND SHOULD BE ***ASAHMED OF YOURSELVES*** THAT YOU "Left on a Saturday morning and came home Sunday night, and he held it the entire time. He had run of the house, too." This is a disgusting, cruel and insensitive thing to do to a housetrained dog. You obviously have NO IDEA of the the physical pain and psychological stress you caused your housetrained dog.

You and your husband should not be owning pets.

[rottweiler_fancier]

Just a few things about crate training -

- It works on the FACT that dogs dislike soiling their sleeping areas; which is an instinct they recieved from their wolve ancestors.

- Using a crate will keep your puppy out of trouble. No worrying while your away if he's chewing a dangerous electric cord, trapped under a fallen item, running the neighborhood because he got out a window or door, or has broken into those chocolate candies you left on the table. Many dogs have died from all of these above causes because their owners trusted them alone too soon and horrible things have happened.

- Crates are a secure place that is a dog's domain. My dog loves her crate, its her sleeping area and where she can get away. Would you rather your puppy go into its soft, familiar crate or under the dark bed, when company [like noisy children] comes over?

- Crates are not a lifetime thing for all dogs. We used it on our dog for about 1 year, after she was finished teething and could control her bladder a while. Currently, she's almost 3 years old and at night, her crate door and she can choose to sleep in the crate or beside my bed [she usually chooses the crate]. Crates also help prepare your dog for free run of the house. Letting an 8 week old puppy run all over the house without supervision is like putting a child in a toy store. Their bound to find something and break it, get hurt, or get into some trouble. Free run of the house is a privilage we save for older dogs who know which parts of the house they can go in and we know they won't be nawing off a table leg while were gone.

A few tips on crate training not mentioned below are:

- Put the crate near a door (preferably a sliding glass door that is easy to open). We had our dogs crate there and every morning we'd open the sliding glass door, then her crate door, and direct her outside. It was just habit for her after a while to go to the sliding glass door when she was let out of her crate.

This is from an information phamplet I picked up at the Humane Society. Print it out and maybe your husband will have a new view on crate training.

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THE MYTH:

"He'll hate being cooped up in there!"

"I'd never put my puppy in a crate."

"It'll drive him crazy."

"Staying in there will make him hyper and destructive."

"So he'll just pee in tehre instead of on the floor."


THE TRUTH:

"He loves his crate...I don't believe it!"

"I'd never raise another dog without a crate."

"It saved my sanity."

"Thanks to the crate, our puppy is always a pleasure and never a problem."

"Its the best way to housebreak a puppy."

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WHAT IS "CRATE TRAINING"?

Crate training is one of the most eficient and effective ways to housetrain a dog. Dogs do not like to soil their resting/sleeping quarters if given adequate opportunity to eliminate elsewhere. Temporarily confining your dog to a small area strongly inhinits the tendency to urinate and defecate. However, there is still a far more important aspect of crate training.

If your dog does not eliminate while she is confined, then she will need to eliminate when she is released., i.e., sge eliminates when you are present to reward and praise her.

Be sure to understand the difference between temporarily confining your dog to a crate and long term confinement when you are not home. The major purpose of confinement when you are not home is to restrict mistakes o a small protected area. The purpose of crate training is quiet the opposite. Short term confinement to a crate is intended to inhibit your dog from eliminating when confined, so that she will want to eliminate when released from confinement and taken to an appropriate area. Crate training also teaches your dog to have bladder and bowel control. Instead of going whenever she feels like it, she learns to hold it and go at convenient scheduled times.

Crate training should not be abused, otherwise the problem will get drastically worse. The crate is not intended as a place to lock up the dog and forget her for extended periods of time. If your dog soils her crate because you left her there too long, the housetraining process will be set back several weeks, if not months.

ADDITIONAL BENEFITS:

*** The virtual elimination of "housetraining" problems and attendant "accidents" in the house.

*** The savings in dollars in cost to repair or replace damaged household items.

*** An assurance that the puppy will develop good habits.

*** Eliminating the likelihood of having to give up a pet because of not being able to cope with its behavioral problems.

TIPS FOR CRATE TRAINING:

- Use a collapsible crate with an epoxy-coated floor pan large enough for an adult dog to stetch out comfortably. A smaller space for a puppy can be created by sliding cardboard between the wire of the crate.

- Keep the crate in a semi-private spot a "people" area. This spot should be away from drafts and direct heat.

- Well before bedtime, place the pup in the crate and offer a treat. Close and lock the gate.

- Immediately establish a routine, using the crate for nap times and whenever the puppy must be left along (3-4 hours). Take outside elimination spot, praise his performance, and go directly inside. The puppy will ten be able to make the association.

- Usually the pup settles quietly in the crate after 3-8 attempts at emotional responses. After the puppy is quiet, keep it inside for about 10 minutes. Do not praise the puppy immediately after releasing it - this can reinforce the desireability of leaving the crate.

- After an interval of 30-45 minutes, repeat the procedure. Extend the pup's quiet time to about 30 minutes. Then gradually extend your absent periods, and, in a short time you can be gone for several hours.

- Provide soft washable bedding and one safe chew toy in the crate. Other than treats, do not put food or water in the crate and do not feed the puppy in the crate.

- Remove your dog's collar and tags to prevent possible entanglement.

REMEMBER...

- Make your attitude toward using a dog crate a positive one!

- Remember that you are doing your puppy a real favor. Crate training will reduce fear, insecurity, and stress-related problems for your puppy.

- You are NOT being cruel.

- A secure dog is a happier dog with a happier owner!

[rottweiler_fancier]

Two more things I wanted to share -

To clean up urine spots, we use resolve carpet cleaner. Rub the spots in a circular motion. we did this and we got pizza tomato sauce out of white carpet (Libby saw the sauce and went for it; missed; and it landed on the carpet.) Have it professionally cleaned or rent a cleaner if you don't have one and do it about once or twice a year.

Secondly, don't shut your dog in the bathroom. If you don't get a crate, at very least use a baby gate and shut him in the kitchen if its tile. Lay down a few blankets and toys and check to make sure all the cupboards are securely shut. Don't allow free run of the house either until he's older or until your able to completely supervise. I'm not sure how big your bathroom or kitchen is, but Kitchens usually are larger, have more light, and windows to look out of, and more traffic. Or if your going to put him in the bathroom, at least use a babygate to close him in. This allows him to see you as you pass by and to listen to things but still be unable to leave.




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- Dana -
"All Rottweilers were created equal"

[Michael C.]

Originally posted by rottweiler_fancier:
Two more things I wanted to share -


Secondly, don't shut your dog in the bathroom. If you don't get a crate, at very least use a baby gate and shut him in the kitchen if its tile. Lay down a few blankets and toys and check to make sure all the cupboards are securely shut. Don't allow free run of the house either until he's older or until your able to completely supervise. I'm not sure how big your bathroom or kitchen is, but Kitchens usually are larger, have more light, and windows to look out of, and more traffic. Or if your going to put him in the bathroom, at least use a babygate to close him in. This allows him to see you as you pass by and to listen to things but still be unable to leave.

Yes! Rotties like being where all the action is and if they cant atleast they will be able to see you with the doggie gate. OUr girl will look out the window and stare for hours. They are very curious dogs.