Keeping attention

[Zimmstx57]

I'm looking for tips to keep the dogs attention when he is walking next to me. Basically, he has a "look at me command" but that only lasts for a couple seconds and doesn't work on a walk. He is 2 yrs old, and is not food motivated at all but is toy motivated but that hasn't seemed to work. He has no behavioral problems and is pretty laid back.

I just need some advice on having him focus his attention to me and staying on me. We are working on it inside the house and making some progress and would appreciate any tips.

Thanks.

[AngelBunny]

Are you looking to have his attention on your 100% of the time? Attention when you're heeling?? What, exactly?

When I'm working Mox and heeling her, I want her focus to be on me, but I don't ask her to do this for extended periods of time. When we're going for a walk, I may slip in some obed, but when we're walking for fun or exercise or simply to be outside together, she's generally free to sniff and do as she pleases.

[bliss7373]

Good advice from Angelbunny!

As I see it, there are two potential problems here. First, you may be expecting something realistic. Full-on attention is really hard for a dog. You're asking them to go against their instincts and ignore lots of really interesting things. I would never expect any dog to give me complete attention for an entire walk. Keep in mind that can take YEARS for a competitive obedience dog to develop the skills to maintain total focus through a heeling routine...and that's just a few minutes.

Second, your success in real life depends upon the foundation you build. If your dog can maintain attention and focus in your living room for 10 minutes, you can expect 2 minutes under greater distraction..if at all. You need to start in environments that are low distraction and slowly build your dog's confidence and ability. What you may be seeing it too big of a leap from low to high distractions.

[Zimmstx57]

Yes, 100% of time, in the heel. Like I said we are doing this in my house, not outside. There are no distractions.

If he sits he'll keep his attention on me but it's hard for him to walk and look at me at the same time.

Any tips/advice to have him keep his focus on me is appreciated.

Thanks

[bliss7373]

Originally Posted by Zimmstx57

Yes, 100% of time, in the heel. Like I said we are doing this in my house, not outside. There are no distractions.

If he sits he'll keep his attention on me but it's hard for him to walk and look at me at the same time.

Any tips/advice to have him keep his focus on me is appreciated.

Thanks

Have you done any research into "Choose to Heel"? This is a very good method of teaching the formal, head-up heeling. It incorporates movement from almost the beginning.

If you're having trouble with movement, make it as easy as you can for him. Two ideas: (1) Move more slowly. Take one sloooooow step forward while asking for attention. Praise like crazy if you get it. Build from there; or

(2) Start with a moving front. Having him sit in front of you, ask for attention. Take one slow, large step back....asking him to come with you and maintain eye contact. Many dogs are often reluctant to take their eyes away from what is right in front of them. This way, he can still do that and be successful. Then use that as a building block.

Are you spitting treats to him while asking for attention? This is a great way to reinforce focus on your face.

[Zimmstx57]

I just tried searching for the CHOOSE TO HEEL but only found mention of it but no one really sums up what it is or how to do it.

The spitting treats sounds like a great idea...I'm going to need to modify the idea to work with a toy as opposed to food though...I'm thinking a tennis ball under the chin or something...

[bliss7373]

Originally Posted by Zimmstx57

I just tried searching for the CHOOSE TO HEEL but only found mention of it but no one really sums up what it is or how to do it.

The spitting treats sounds like a great idea...I'm going to need to modify the idea to work with a toy as opposed to food though...I'm thinking a tennis ball under the chin or something...

Google it and you'll get more hits. I bought the books and video made by Dawn Jecs and thought they were an excellent investment.

As far as the ball under the chin, sure you can use that! The downside is that you will have to fade it fast, as a visible lure will quickly become a bribe. But that's true for treats too!

I typically use food for precision and teaching, tug/ball for motivation. Just as an idea if your dog is totally non-food motivated, perhaps start with a squeaky ball. Then, as you're fading the visible toy, you can take the squeaker out of a plush toy and either hide it in your hand or even in your mouth.

[SABELLESMOM]

I don't use a "look at me" at all. Particularly when the dog is walking beside me. Dogs need to "pay attention". They need not look to know where you are in relation to them.

Think about it. When you walk with your friends, are you craning your neck to look at them or do you know where they are by sound and peripheral vision? A dog is no different.

If you want him to pay attention, you need to make the exercise more interesting and rewarding. Change direction. Right turn. Left turn. Stop. Circle. Do figure 8. Add some downs and sits. Reward... at least with your voice, and some animation so he KNOWS he got it right. Once he fully recognizes, "YES! I got it!" He will develop pride, and THAT becomes a motivator as well. They like to know they're smart, and proud of it! Stop and supply a play reward if he is not treat motivated. Is there a ball he likes? A frisbee? A tug game? A nice rub down? Find what DOES motivate him and makes him happy. Use those.

Become more interesting than what's ahead of him. You have to be more interesting than a big hunk of liver, or steak. Tho, I'd guess he would be more interested in food treats if you do 2 things: 1) make sure the dog is HUNGRY! 2) use high end treats... 1/4" dices of leftover pork chop, chicken, hot dog, cheese, boiled liver, etc.

[Harleys-Mom5332]

I learned a long time ago not to expect my non-border collies and non-golden dogs to wrap themselves around me and keep constant eye contact with me while heeling.

This is not in most dog's nature. I have never had points taken off at trials for not having this type of heeling.

I agree with Sabellesmom whole heartedly. If you want really good attention then make it more interesting. I do a whole routine of fast heeling and turns and stops with my dogs when I don't feel they are paying attention. This works great for me and wakes them back up. It's a game for them.

When we are out walking I don't expect my dogs to be dead on heeling, but when I give the "Heel" command they pop right into position and it's all work.

Also keep in mind that often, particularly with our breed, the dog may not look like he's watching but is. My dogs can be leisurely walking at my side and look like there is little or no attention, but let me turn or stop and they are dead on. Most dogs are watching your left leg. That is were your cues should be coming from.

[Skip]

I've never been a fan of "focus heeling". My boy just took "High in Trial" for the obedience portion for his IPO3, against quite a few shepherds, and I've never insisted on "focus heeling". I think it is mis-used and over-rated. "Attention" at times, yes, but constant head turned to the right to stare up at the handler...nope. I've also heard from quite a few judges that it is being overdone.

[Rottlva]

MY problem with Choose to heel is there is no choice....I've seen multiple "choose to heel" dogs who choose "not" to heel.....a balance of want to and have to is the way to go.....


Also, the wrap is very out of style. At this point ideal in AKC obed is to have the dog heeling at the pant seam...more of a position you'd see in Europe. :)

[Skip]

Originally Posted by Rottlva

MY problem with Choose to heel is there is no choice....I've seen multiple "choose to heel" dogs who choose "not" to heel.....a balance of want to and have to is the way to go.....

....

You lost me,,,...what are you talking about??? You say "there is no choice" and also "choose "not" to heal"...

[Rottlva]

Choose to heel is a book written by Dawn Jecs. You basically allow the dog to make the choice- when it joins up with you in heel position, it gets rewarded, when it doesn't, it doesn't get rewarded. All good if we lived in a perfect world where we were ALWAYS the primary motivator.

Where I train, we call the "choose to heel" dogs those dogs who have learned that attention is optional, basically instead of not allowing for inattention, or correcting loss of attention, they wait until the dog regains the focus and then reward the regain of focus. Obviously an obedience dog must pay attention-there are no options!

Skip what is said was more or less a joke....The problem with the theory "choose to heel" is there SHOULD BE NO choice! If I say heel, you heel! There isn't a choice to not heel, yes?? I matched at a match where a woman put out toys all over the floor and just started heeling away without her dog (A Choose to heel dog) . As the dog sniffed the toys, grabbed a few and played, she continued on without her dog...finally the dog grew tired of the toys, figured the owner might have a cookie and trotted over and started to heel....click treat...the dog "chose to heel". Again, all great and dandy if the primary motivator were on the scene all of the time, but without the "have to" compulsion, the balance of obedience isn't there.

Hope that was clear?

[Skip]

Yeah, that was a little more clear.

[bliss7373]

Originally Posted by Rottlva

Choose to heel is a book written by Dawn Jecs. You basically allow the dog to make the choice- when it joins up with you in heel position, it gets rewarded, when it doesn't, it doesn't get rewarded. All good if we lived in a perfect world where we were ALWAYS the primary motivator.

Where I train, we call the "choose to heel" dogs those dogs who have learned that attention is optional, basically instead of not allowing for inattention, or correcting loss of attention, they wait until the dog regains the focus and then reward the regain of focus. Obviously an obedience dog must pay attention-there are no options!

Skip what is said was more or less a joke....The problem with the theory "choose to heel" is there SHOULD BE NO choice! If I say heel, you heel! There isn't a choice to not heel, yes?? I matched at a match where a woman put out toys all over the floor and just started heeling away without her dog (A Choose to heel dog) . As the dog sniffed the toys, grabbed a few and played, she continued on without her dog...finally the dog grew tired of the toys, figured the owner might have a cookie and trotted over and started to heel....click treat...the dog "chose to heel". Again, all great and dandy if the primary motivator were on the scene all of the time, but without the "have to" compulsion, the balance of obedience isn't there.

Hope that was clear?

I agree with this, to the extent that I don't think Choose to Heel is the be-all, end-all to heeling and that it isn't the final step (or even close to) in teaching a competition heel.

But I do think that it's very useful to start building the "want to" that you speak of and to help the dog become accustomed to the motion and position. It's a good learning tool for a dog that doesn't equate attention and motion at the same time. It is often relied upon too much, sure. The OP is having trouble getting his/her dog focused on him at all while moving, ergo it might help. Of course corrections (i.e your "have to") can be added once the dog knows what is expected, is successful at the behavior, and can take some responsibility.