Age / Prong Collar

[Helen B.]

What age can be considered to young for using a prong collar?

[Miabella]

Hi Helen,

I personally wouldn't use a prong on a dog less than a year old, or maybe older. I truly believe that the learning phase of obedience training should be done entirely with positive motivation, and such a young dog is still learning. But maybe other people have different opinions, and I'm interested to hear them.

p.s. I grew up in Dracut, MA, and my parents still live there. ;)

[Loki's Mom]

I had to get a prong collar for Loki shortly after rescuing her at 5 months old. She would pull me all over the yard. I had a choker on her at first but she would still pull me. A friend of mine here at work told me that her Golden did the same to her and she bought the prong collar and solved the problem...so I thought it wouldn't hurt to try...As soon as it came in, we started using it. I no longer had to get a good grip on her to stop her. At the slightest little tug, she stopped in her tracks and sat down. I think that you should get one as soon as the dog becomes "stronger" than you, no matter what age or how much training they have had.

[TrishB]

Out of curiosity, why are you using a prong collar? I have this discussion all the time with people at my barn about horses. Why are you going to a more strict bit? Have you tried the easier ones?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying anything bad about them. When a prong collar is used properly on a dog that requires it, they're a dream!

However, I do think that many people using them don't know how to use them properly. Just like any tool, there is a right and wrong way to use a prong collar. And just like any tool, there is a right situation and a wrong situation for them.

I suggest that you take your dog to obedience classes and have your trainer help you to decide what, when and how you will use these training tools on your dog. :)

[Eyerman]

Instead of a prong collar try a GENTLE LEADER! Both my dogs are using gentle leaders and they are a miracle. I don't know what people think of them on this forum but I will always use it because of the positive results I and many others have seen. It is not a muzzle, they still have full function of their mouth. Contact a trainer to make sure you use it properly. If you decide to change. I don't like prong collars because I know I wouldnt like prongs driving into my neck. Just a suggestion,

[LORHEL]

Gentle leaders or halti's both work very well for dogs who like to pull. I would suggest that instead of the prong collar for now. :)

[Sansano]

Originally posted by Eyerman
Instead of a prong collar try a GENTLE LEADER! Both my dogs are using gentle leaders and they are a miracle. I don't like prong collars because I know I wouldnt like prongs driving into my neck. Just a suggestion,

And therin lies the problem. They are a 'miracle cure'. They do not solve the problem through learning or obedience. Also, you really lose the ability to give corrections AND once you take the collar off the dog will more than likely pull again. The prong helps you deal with the problem and not the symptons. Fair corrections will help your dog learn not to pull and eventually you will be able to use a glat collar.

PS. The prongs don't 'drive' into the dogs neck.

[Sansano]

If used correctly I would suggest putting on a pinch collar around 6 months of age BUT remember you have a puppy still so please don't try to take his/her head off with the correction. In fact, at first they will probably correct themselves as they pull. Remember, be fair to the dog in terms of the severity of corrections and you and your dog will learn to work much better together. When my dog sees me get out the prong, they are super excited. They know it means we are going to work/play and treats and prasie are forthcoming. When I used to use the gentle leader they would mope and hate to put it on....

[Ramon]

I tried the halti (similar to the gentle leader) on both a rottie and an american bulldog. I got the same results. They both hated it so much they refused to follow me. By comparison, the prong collar is less distracting and gives a more meaningful correction when used properly. That means placing it snugly and high up on the neck and giving a firm and quick pop on the leash and then releasing it immediately.
If you are going to train your puppy for protection, you should probably strive to train 100% positively until the dog is a year old (more or less depending on the dog). Some of that means avoiding situations where you have to use corrections. If you're not strong enough to hold your ground while your dog is pulling on a flat collar, you might have to go to the gym. :)
If you are not training for protection, I think the right time to use a prong collar will depend on the dog. When I took my 5 month old american bulldog to a pre-agility class, he was already so strong that he probably would've torn my shoulder if I didn't switch to a prong collar. Luckily for me, he still had enough drive that I can now work him in protection.

[bratdogmom]

I usually don't recommend a prong collar to my students until all other avenues have been tried, including the Gentle Leader. I feel theat the GL is a betetr product than an Halti and can produce better results than a prong collar. That said I usually don't recommend a head collar for people that are planning on competeing in anything but agility.

Please find a good trainer in your area that can help you work through this time with your pup:)

Stacy

[bratdogmom]

Also a "pop" should never be ,ade on a prong collar. That is not how they are designed. If you are using the coillar correctly a slight turn of your wrist will administer the correct amount of pressure.

Stacy

[Ramon]

Originally posted by bratdogmom
Also a "pop" should never be made on a prong collar. That is not how they are designed. If you are using the collar correctly a slight turn of your wrist will administer the correct amount of pressure.

I disagree. A slight turn of your wrist is nagging. A sudden pop with the right amount of force is a true correction. If you have a hard dog, nagging will do almost nothing, while one or two real corrections will often be enough to save you from using that kind of compulsion in the future. I've been taught that method by trainers who've competed nationally in Schutzhund. It doesn't sound politically correct, but it works!

[Judi W]

Helen,
You do not say how old your dog is. When it is a puppy I am raising, I teach it from a very early age to be light to the leash and responsive to what I determine is the limit allowed in weight or pressure against the lead. That being the case, a simple slip training lead is all I use in working the dog in obedience or friendly casual walking.

If someone gives me an untrained older pup or dog that has no respect for the lead and no need for social approval (bait and approval don't mean anything to that dog) then I have no problem with using a pinch. Students who arrive with a 10 month old never been taught anything, dog dragging the owner from pillar to post get the recommendation of a pinch, properly fitted and used correctly.

If you have not been in some training classes learning how to use motivation and correct lead work, please don't just get a pinch as a substitute for training and teaching the dog and learning yourself how to do both. A pinch is simply a tool used in conjunction with training.

How old is your dog and what have you done with it so far in the way of training and what are the problems you are experiencing? That information is best given rather than just "how old" before I can use the pinch.

[Helen B.]

Sorry I didn’t get back sooner or give more details to my ?.

I would like to thank everyone who responded and for those who don’t know me, supply you with a little background and the season for my question.

Let me start by saying I have been involved with rottweiler’s for the last 9 years, have 2 of my own, Bru and Faust and have attend more classes than I can remember. I have used a prong collar for training and am quite aware of the proper method and fit to which it should be used.

Now, the reason for my ? is. A family member has a 6 ½ month old Border Collie that has been attending classes for the last 3 month. I have also been attending the classes and watching his progress or should I say lack of progress when it comes to heeling. No matter how many times you get him back into position with food, toys or a correction he just keeps pulling. The buckle collar is doing nothing and I personally would rather then use a prong collar than a choker or a halti as long as it is used correctly. I would also like to add that he is well on his way into adolescence and has suddenly acquired “selective hearing syndrome”. So in my opinion the change in collar would help and since it has been such a long time since I have had a puppy I figured I would ask here first before having them approach the trainer about switch to the prong.

My only concern is his age. 6 ½ months.

I hope this info helps and look forward to your replies.

[Judi W]

go for it.