little help..not sure what to think about this. Parvo threat?

[aldelgreco]

I just took missy in for her second round of shots.
she is 11 wks old.
I have been told on this board that after the second round of shots, that i can start her in Puppy K. My vet told me in no uncertain terms that taking her out ANYWHERE right now (in Austin) is potentially deadly because of a 300% rise in the amount of puppies coming in with parvo. she said it seems to be some sort of epidemic around here right now.
this is the vet at animal trustees, a non-profit organization with very forward-thinking ideologies. they also do fantastic things around here with adoptions, $18 shots and $30 neuters/spays.
She emphasized the importance of getting her into obedience training, but said (and this is what really made me worry) that i had to wait until AFTER THE 4TH round of shots to even start taking her out on walks, obedience classes, soccer fields, hike and bike trail, greenbelt, etc. That would put her at 17 weeks before anything formal started as far as training, as well as good exercise/socialization outside of our yard, cars and the occasional romp around a friend's house maybe. It seems too long, but it's what the vet told me. I am already doing clicker training and she is getting along very well.

1) Did anyone else have to get 4 rounds of shots? At animal trustees, they told me that they give all rots 4 rounds just to be extra-careful. apparently they are more susceptible to some things as puppies than others?

2) Is she right? I know you guys have said puppy k can start after the second round of shots, but how real a threat is parvo? is it worth gambling on? are there some kinds of areas where one would be VERY UNLIKELY to find parvo? Is it airborne? bloodborne, etc?

3) what would you do as far as training and socialization if you were in my shoes?

any advice is appreciated. NishasMom got me in touch with a great trainer here, but i need to get my calendar figured out as i leave town in june for a two week tour and would like to know whether i can get started before then, or just wait it out due to the threat of parvo.

holla
alex

[Nishasmom]

I would wait until the 3rd set of shots. Your vet is right, Parvo is bad here; I was a very paranoid owner as well!

No dog parks (hike and bike trail at Town Lake) until she has her 4th set. So many dogs go there, I wouldn't trust it. Greenbelt should be fine after 3 sets, so should class, walks around the block, and soccer fields (again, NOT the one at Zilker...too many dogs).

The main thing is to stay away from places that a lot of dogs frequent. After 3 sets she should be covered...at least that is what my vet said. When on walks don't let her smell any poop, ect.

[aldelgreco]

missy is going to love you for giving me so much help ; )
i emailed nancy about this same thing, so hopefully she will have some insight as well.

i guess i will just tough it out around here. we have 4 of these guys now, so it can get a little rowdy, but i can wear her out in the backyard, and the clicker training right afterwards usually gets her really tuckered out once we have gone for 5-10 minutes. it is funny how mental excercise wears them down as fast as physical exercise sometimes!

thanks again, any input from others about ways to get her more ready to roll while we are under this quarantine would be appreciated!

[Nishasmom]

You got a clicker! How do you like it?

[gilby00]

When I meet w/my buyers, I tell them not until the puppy is done with shots period. They can take them to houses that have never had a sick dog, they can walk them on concrete since parvo is killed by sunlight/chlorine. better to be safe than sorry, I think the average cost of parvo vet bill is around 3000. another month at home is much cheaper

[hokisteph5]

IMO, the need for socialization is more important than a threat of parvo. If you wait until 16 or 17 weeks, a critical socialization window will have closed.

Here are a couple of threads that have input from more knowledgeable members than me -

Socialization vs. Parvo
Critical Periods of Canine Development

[brunie's mom]

Seems very excessive to me! Why don't you have a titer done after the second set of shots...usually it's done 10 days after the shot. This will let you know if there is proper immunity levels.

I know that in some places parvo is bad, and more precautions should be taken...but if the puppy vaccinations are not given at the right time (intervals) or started at the right time, or the brand of vaccine is not effective....then you can give 10 sets of vaccines and they will not be covering parvo.

Have a titer done and then you will know. We've had members here that have had their pups get parvo at 6-7 months of age...after they have had all of the shots...it was because immunity had not happened.

If all of the puppies in the puppy class have had their sets of vaccines, and have proof...I really would not be too worried.
I would be more worried of owning an unsocialized Rottweiler.

Gina

[4zenuff]

yeah, my vet said two weeks after the 3rd set of shots. I'm a paranoid person when it comes to parvo and my kids health in general (canine and human) so I waited. I taught my pup a lot of things at home anyhow. We also went for "walks" on the concrete, in the middle of the road and I had people come over to meet her....some with pets, some not.

It seems like a long wait, but it will be worth it.

[aldelgreco]

Originally Posted by Nishasmom

You got a clicker! How do you like it?

haha. yea. figured i would get her a headstart.
i'm no trainer, but i watched enough youtube videos, etc. to kind of know what is going on, and she definitely knows that the click marks a behavior. she is getting better at almost everything, and it helps her to know to stop at "sit" and not go to the "down" position unless i instruct her. for a while, she figured out it was sit-treat, down-treat, etc. so she would sit, get a treat, then go down without being instructed, so it has helped with that a lot.

i'm getting two sides of this story here.
brunie's mom, etc...let me ask you this....does it help in any way that she is growing up with three other dogs who all represent different personalities of the spectrum?

we have 4:

1)Boston is a super-alpha big boy- an akita. he is my girlfriend's dog and he is getting up in age, so it is hard to teach him now..but she rescued him in college and did not a lick of obedience with him. he minds me and is a good guard dog, but he has horrible resource guarding instincts that she has had to learn to deal with. she is still a little scared of him (she'll run away if he is trying to "play", but it seems she is getting more and more used to him all the time. ) Any time they are together, play is supervised until i can trust him fully or until he kicks the bucket or just gets too old to care to play, which could be coming soon, who knows.

2) Oskar- another dog my girl brought into the home. 5 pound chihuahua with very poor social skills as far as i am concerned. he can't play worth a dam. he wants to, and is all around a good boy, but has a shrill little bark and jerky little scared, nippy attitude when it comes to playing that i can tell makes the others not really want to play with him. definitely a weird little dog to be around. once again, he came with the girlfriend. package deal : )

3) Charles- Dachshund. my dog. trained from the moment i rescued him. they are best friends. they love playing in the back yard and ruff housing and tug of war. she is already whooping him and she only 11 weeks.

4) Missy.


So, i think that i am better off than someone who had to keep her in isolation completely from other dogs, and i am glad she is learning doggy manners around a super alpha type male personality.
I worry though that they are all 3 males, and their could be a possibility that she could start thinking of herself as top bitch and develop anything weird out of that, which could lead to same-sex aggression.

do any of you guys have thoughts on this? Do you feel like the "socialization" i am describing is enough to get by until time for shots?
also, i should add i am a musician and don't work during the day, so i am always here with them and she goes in the car with me everywhere i go on errands just to get her used to the sights and smells of the city from out the window.

I am most worried about my dog's life. parvo is life threatening. i don't care about the money, i have pet insurance and wouldn't care even if i didn't. i just don't want to see her in all that pain, etc. So, unless anyone has a FOOL-PROOF way of making sure she doesn't get it where i can still take her around...then i think i will just take the advice of the people on this thread who aired on the side of caution RE: parvo.

[poohbearsmom]

http://www.doglogic.com/Dr.Dodd-VaccineSchedule2005.doc

The above link contains the vaccination protocol that I use.


VACCINOSIS


I read recently that there is a new strain of Parvo which is especially virulent and has even affected adult vaccinated dogs out West, so I'm sure the veterinarians are being very careful, and stressing vaccination.

You might discuss this protocol with your veterinarian, and see what he says.

I would use this protocol on a puppy who's dam has a good titre level, but would probably be more cautious with a pup from unknown background (rescue, byb, etc..).

[Max'smom]

As far as the formal training...........My trainer if I would want would come to my house for a private lesson. More expensive of course, but it might be an idea. Is that a possibility? It would help a little with human socialization. I was able to start ob/puppy k classes with my Max after his second round of shots, along with a kennel cough shot. But that was according to my vet and the trainer, but we don't have as much of a threat of parvo around my area as you do.