Arthur is a handful this week!

[alice's mommy]

Arthur, now 19.5 weeks old, has decided that "listening" isn't really all it's cracked up to be! He got into a snarling match with another dog during the socialization/play time at his puppy class (the other dog kept trying to go on top of his head with both paws and Arthur wasn't having any of that) and had to be in a "time out" on leash twice during play time. Arthur lunged at someone passing on the sidewalk this week. He was about to pee and got distracted by a passer-by. He isn't listening as quickly for "sit" and "down" ...and seems to have forgotten what that whole "stay" was about.

Yesterday was a bad one. I had given him a pigs ear (after reading on here last night that pigs ears aren't good for them, the whole bag has been thrown out) and went to pat his head. He growled at me! I have consistently worked with him on "drop it" and rewarding with a yummy treat and "thought" that food/resource guarding wasn't a problem anymore...but I'm wrong. I sternly reprimanded him, off he went to the crate (tried to not make it a "punishment", but probably was this time) and threw out the pigs ears.

I've been on the computer for HOURS since last night researching these behaviours.

Is this the teenage months?! I've been doing NILIF....however I think I have been a little too free with the affection. I do make him sit before every rub/pat....but perhaps that's just rote for him now.

Just a tad discouraged.

[brunie's mom]

Awww...don't be discouraged. Puppies are like kids, they are never perfect...just enjoy the times when they do listen.

At 5 months of age...I think he's getting a bit old to be having a free-for all play with the puppies in class. He probably needs more structure, less play in class?
How many puppies in the class? and what are the age ranges?

They do go through stages of not listening...and doing things slowly...and just when you wonder where that well behaved puppy went....they start listening.

He's a pup...he is still learning. Maybe it's time to make things more interesting? or change the reward?

Yes...pig ears and raw bones seem to bring out the "wolf-dog" out in even the nicest of puppies. They get very possessive of these items. These are things you keep working on. Throw out the pig ears...they are fatty, greasy and usually are chewed up in only a couple of minutes...and often diarrhea follows. If you can get cow ears, they are a much better, lower fat alternative...as are bully sticks.

Don't worry about putting him in the crate...if it gives you a 'time out'....before you lose your temper it's fine.

Gina

[debbiej]

good you are on top of his behavior. I personally think 5 months is young to consider teenage years. I think you are describing a perfect example of why people say "he is a puppy, he can't be considered trained yet". pups are changing constantly. there is a lot going on! so this week Aurther learned a few more things he can't get away with, but he isn't a bad dog for trying....

[AngelBunny]

Training a puppy young lays a solid foundation that never goes away. You may think it does when the puppy goes thru his or her evil twin phase and you're tearing your hair and getting discouraged. Just remember This too shall pass. Just keep on the tyke's back and don't let the little beast get away with anything. He'll return to flying right.

Personally, I'm not a fan of young dogs who're going thru a bratty phase gamboling and playing off leash with other young dogs. Bullying and other undesirable behavior starts to emerge. Puppy socialization is important, but I don't see the need for a bunch of young, semi-trained dogs to frisk around.

[alice's mommy]

Arthur's puppy class is supposed to be for puppies under 6 months, but there are a few that are 7 and 9 months old, as well as a year old german shepherd. I find it hard when they're off-leash and then supposed to come back on leash and sit beside our chairs to keep Arthur contained. Most of the other "puppies" aren't as big as he is and when they're straining to get to Arthur, he has a hard time concentrating. We usually spend that time doing puppy-push-ups so his focus is on me, but then when we're supposed to do the exercises the instructor was teaching us while we were sitting, Arthur is already worn out. Maybe that's why he got so crazy in class? Too much for a solid hour.

So what you're saying is.....sigh....this isn't even the teenage time yet? Patience, be mine!

[BradNMelissaWolfe]

I have been there too.. I agree with above posts, don't give up and training never ends, our pup will try to take a mile when given and inch.... just remember firm but fair and have fun with your puppy. NILIF works pretty well for us though I am sure like most we are guilty of slipping up on NILIF and if we see negative behavior start to return we kinda get more strict with it again.

[jlaack]

I find it hard when they're off-leash and then supposed to come back on leash and sit beside our chairs to keep Arthur contained.

When they are "off leash" are they truly off leash? Since he isn't focused during these times if he is truly off leash I would probably keep him on leash or at least on a long line so you can enforce come back to me if he isn't responding to a verbal command(s). Has your trainer provided any concrete suggestions? If he starts to be a real weeny during the hour long session is there a place you can take him for a nice brisk walk and then attempt to return? Really the trainer should be addressing his behavior and giving you specific tools to use during these times especially when they are occurring in class. When I have taken classes if a dog is struggling one of the assistants (or the trainer) will immediately provide one on one assistance. Training classes are the place to learn for the owner and the dog and by letting poor behavior slide a golden opportunity to learn is being missed.

If your trainer isn't actively providing support, ask for some.

[alice's mommy]

jlaak: When they're "off leash", we literally take their leashes off and the dogs are all running around the big gymnasium that we have class in. If I keep him on a leash during this play time, would it be dangerous for him with all the other dogs running on his leash?
When the other dogs are straining at Arthur during our instruction phase, while we're sitting, sometimes the instructor will toss a toy to a few of the dogs to distract them...but if Arthur isn't one of them he starts wanting to get to the toy.
The only thing that seems to hold his attention during the sitting/instruction times (which can be up to 15 minutes at a time) is if I'm mainlining him treats for sits/downs/etc....but then he gets full and loses focus again.

I think you have a good idea here, though. I'm going to ask the instructor to help with Arthur during our instruction time so I can see what I should be doing to get him to settle down. See if she can do it. lol

[jlaack]

When they're "off leash", we literally take their leashes off and the dogs are all running around the big gymnasium that we have class in.

If I were you I personally would not be participating in this uncontrolled play time. I would instead use it as a time to work within distractions. I would probably keep my dog on leash and at the periphery of the play time group and work my dog during this time. I realize he is young but he should be starting to keep his attention on you at this point. I think the free for all is counter productive, honestly. You set the dogs up to have 'freedom' but then expect them to work and focus? This is good socialization for young puppies but he is beyond the point (same for the older dogs in his class).

[Calin]

Don't fret. My dog goes through her naughty stages as well. It seems to me that every time I teach her to be good, she figures out a new way to be bad! If I didn't love her so, I'd bop her on her little brat head! :)

[moondog]

Originally Posted by alice's mommy

Arthur, now 19.5 weeks old, has decided that "listening" isn't really all it's cracked up to be! He got into a snarling match with another dog during the socialization/play time at his puppy class (the other dog kept trying to go on top of his head with both paws and Arthur wasn't having any of that).

Class time is not play time with other dogs, it's play time with their owner. I had Chili in puppy classes, and even at 11 weeks there was no free-for-all for the puppies enrolled. He needs to learn that class time is learning time and he's not going to get that if the dogs are let off leash to cavort.

I would find a class that is structured for teaching/learning rather than spending valuable class time as an impromptu dog park. He'd be much better off to learn to ignore other dogs in class rather than be encouraged to interact with them.

I'd be in a heap of trouble now (at 2 yrs) if Chili had been taught that class time is play time with the other dogs.

[rencook]

Also, if the is a puppy class-what is a year old dog doing there?? There is a huge difference between a 5 month old pup and a year old dog. I would be looking for a more structured class-without the "free" time.
My puppy class that I run is for pups 8-20 weeks old-after that its time for "big dog" obedience.

[qopmag2000]

My Nala is almost 21weeks old. Two weeks ago in puppy class, she decided she wasn't going to pay attention or obey my husband or me. I primarily do all the training, but my husband does some too. After what seemed to be a thousand "down" cues, she finally went down. Now we seem to be back on track. Our trainer told us she will have her moments, don't let up and say forget it when she doesn't respond to the cue the first 1-10 times-- keep saying it until she does it. I think my voice was shot after last Wednesday's class :)

[alice's mommy]

Thank you all for the advice! Arthur has been oddly FABULOUS the last two days. Now he's sitting perfectly while we get our jackets on....is "drop it"-ing perfectly every single time....doing a much better "stay....etc., etc.. I guess we just needed to ride that out. I will be revisiting this thread when he inevevitably goes "wonky" on me again - lol.

I have also decided to switch training schools after this session is over, to a place where they work more one on one with you. Arthur and I and "free for all" play times just don't work well together. lol

[debbiej]

I agree, and think free for all playtimes are a bad idea for everyone!