Need advise with Tex and the cats/dog!

[ReeboksMomForever]

Tex, who will be 12 weeks on 3/27, runs after our three inside cats who swat him in his face (they are clawless) and hiss at him but now he is getting one of the cats to the ground and either standing above it or laying on it. I need advise on how to get him to stop this as I am sure it is not a good thing!

He also chases after my DH's 11 year old lab (who stays outside) and bites his tail, ear, etc. and won't let go! The lab, who is a sweetheart and wouldn't hurt a flea, will either flip around to get him off (which may or may not work) or will bark at him (which doesn't work).

He also puppy bites us on the hand/arm but sometimes it can be a little hard. I was telling him 'no bite' but was told by a trainer that you are suppose to let them bite you as a puppy but if it gets too hard that I am suppose to 'yelp' like a dog but this doesn't help at all. In the old days I would pop him in the nose and tell him no but it seems it's a 'no touch' way now!

I don't know if the above are puppy issues (it's been so long) and that maybe he'll grow out of them or not? We start puppy classes on April 12th - can't wait .

I will take any advice I can get!

[molochai2580]

As far as the biting goes, redirect him to a toy that he can bite and chew on, and praise him when he redirects to the toy.

As far of the chasing of the indoor cats, try leashing him to you when your in the house, that way he can't. He needs to learn the rules of the house and proper behavior. It might also be something he never gets over due to a higher prey drive. (I'm just throwing ideas out, someone with more experience with this might have a better idea.)
I would also do the same with him outside until he learns that he's not supposed to annoy the other dog or the cats.

This isn't really something I ever had to deal with, but it does sound like regular puppy behavior to me, with time, patience, and lots of training, these issues should resolve themselves.

Also if you not already, I would enroll in a good obedience class. I'm not sure why your trainer told you to let the puppy bite you, this sends up a red flag to me about this particular trainer. I have never allowed my pups to bite on me. Hope this helps. good luck and keep us posted on your progress.

[hokisteph5]

You are dealing with a puppy, but now's the time to start teaching him manners. When it comes to the cats, what worked in my house was to put baby gates on the areas I wanted to be "dog free zones." Primarily my cats' litter boxes and food dishes are in these zones. If you notice he's running after them indoors, I would keep him on a leash and near you at all times.

When it comes to the biting, I would keep saying "no bite" and would also redirect the puppy to bite on something appropriate (e.g. nylabone, stuffed toy, or my personal favorite - a chilly bone). You'll probably have to redirect many times before the puppy understands.

[zorro13]

I have 6 cats here and one dog. I had no problem with my two rotts in this area, but not to say that I wouldn't in the future. But, with my current dog Zorro, who is not a rottweiler, he was quite another issue regarding this as a pup. I used the leash with down/stays and the baby gate to no avail. As with all these cats, they just kept jumping the gate all the time. And, I had a very exuberant and insistent pup.

As Zorro became more insistent on chasing the cats here, I had to become more insistent that he didn't. While I do teach re-directing, as he loves chasing balls and such, he still wasn't satisfied with that. So I figured it was time this pup learned that no is no and I mean business when I say it. With my husband objecting each and every time, I would first tell him no, grab Zorro by the scruff of his neck, stop his behavior for 2 seconds, and tell him no chasing. I did that about 3 times/different occasions,not three times in a row, and he was still in chase mode. Then, the next 3 times when I grabbed him by the scruff of the neck and told him no, I brought him up on his hind legs, he was still insistent. Then the next time, he got no,he got scruff, the no again, and I pulled him off all 4 legs and said no again, he yelped, but he still didn't get it. I had to repeat that process a couple more times, until the one day he went achasing again, and got a very firm NO, as he always got first, it was that time, finally, that he stopped and he was praised. There are only 2 times when I will grab their scruff of their neck and that is with cats/smaller animals or children.

Use re-direction for the cat chasing along with leashing and down/stays, use the leash to control the pup around the older dog as this pup needs to learn some manners, don't put the older dog in a position to get fed up one day.

I've also never heard of a trainer saying a pup is supposed to bite you, while they do bite you anyhow LOL, still an interesting take on that from the trainer. Use re-direction again, the pup is coming into teething, so ice cubes, chilly bones (these are great frozen toys) and some people use frozen hot dogs to help during this period. Teething is a very stressful time on a pup, so keep lessons short and sweet and offer praise for correct behavior. Make sure you take some walks througout the day, enough good romps in the backyard to utilize all that puppy energy, and when they get too out of control trying to rip the clothes off your body LOL, teach him to calm down with 'easy easy easy' slowing down your body movements and using a soothing calm tone, to calm the lord of the jungle. And, good luck in puppy class!!!

[FenrisUlfr]

Other thing we did for the biting (when we'd redirect and he'd drop the toy right away and go for us again) was to stand up, face away from him, cross our arms, and stare at the ceiling. He *hates* being ignored, so he learned pretty quickly that biting us isn't fun. We used the same method when he took up attempting to herd us places.

[ReeboksMomForever]

Thank you all for your great advice! As I mentioned, it has been years since I've had a puppy! I have gates to the downstairs (where the cat boxes/food/water are), to the upstairs and to our bedroom but the cats jump them so they definitely come into where Tex is - I'll keep a thin leash on him to keep him from chasing the cats and may try the 'scruff of the neck' if redirecting doesn't work. I will definitely get a chilly bone or use frozen hot dogs (which I already have) and will try the stand up/look at ceiling way of ignoring him when he gets to biting. Sometimes if he grabs my jeans I'll either just stand there and he'll let go or I'll tell him to 'drop it' and he does. I put a leash on Tex earlier outside with the lab and told him 'no' when he went to bite the lab - will try redirecting and 'scruff of the neck' if he still doesn't listen here also! It does seem that he has a high prey drive - are grass and sticks considered prey?! We have about 60 acres so we definitely go on walks off and on leash up and down hill so he gets quite a bit of exercise and I take him into our small town and walk him on leash and take him into some of the stores to socialize him - of course, everyone just adores him!

I couldn't believe it either that the trainer said to let him bite and yelp if it hurts - of course it hurts! The clicker puppy classes are at the same place but she is not scheduled to be my trainer. I'm anxious to see how it goes! As I mentioned earlier, the first class is April 12th so I'll let you know how it goes and how I like my trainer!

Thanks again everyone!

[Ayoka]

I'm not 100% sold on the scruffing technique as there will come a time when you can't do this (either the dog won't stand for it or he'll be too heavy to pick up) and I also wonder if it wouldn't make a puppy hand-shy...everything you do to a young dog can have a lasting effect on them so I would lean towards less physical methods.

We Brought Bear (at a year old) into a home with 5 cats..now there's just 2...we provided the "no dog zone", which was essentially the top 2 floors of the house...and now when Bear get's too pushy with the cats, they are VERY good at letting him know they have had enough and he has a healthy respect for them (and their claws).

Your puppy is exactly that, a puppy, so create a dog free zone and keep a leash on him when the cats are near so that you have some control over what he does and does not do. When he goes for the cats, "say leave" it and then distract him with something else like a good treat or another toy...hopefully he will make the connection but many dogs just can't live with cats, their prey drive is too high. All else failing, you have to be prepared to keep them seperated. For life.

[AngelBunny]

Originally Posted by ReeboksMomForever

...may try the 'scruff of the neck' if redirecting doesn't work.

What's scruff of the neck?? If you take a biting, mouthing puppy and shake the puppy by his or her neck, chances are you'll rachet the puppy up and the biting and mouthing will escalate. Redirection--a bazillion times--is what you need to do.

How much physical exercise is your puppy getting? Perhaps one of the reasons he's such a brat is that he's insufficiently worn out due to lack of mental and physical exercise. Running around for a few minutes each day, harrassing the Lab, isn't exercise. Organized times of going for a walk and fetching a ball is exercise.

If a trainer told me to let my Rottie puppy bite me, I'd be looking for another trainer.

[ReeboksMomForever]

Just goes to show you how the advice you get can be from one part of the scale to the other. Some told me to use the scruff of the neck, now others are telling me NOT to use the scruff of the neck.....I'll try re-directing for him biting the other critters and I already say 'no bite' when he bites us and will also try re-directing/ignoring him.

Angelbunny - My brat, as you so sweetly called him, definitely gets exercise - as my last post stated we have 60 acres and we go on walks/runs up and down the hill and all over the property - he's definitely pooped when we get back and lets me know that he is ready for a nice nap! And I also stated that we go into town and go for walks too. We also play fetch with the ball....

I am NOT using the trainer that told me to let the puppy bite me - she just answered the phone - my trainer is another person!

[Ayoka]

Originally Posted by ReeboksMomForever

Just goes to show you how the advice you get can be from one part of the scale to the other.

That's for sure and it is the beauty of a forum like this...it's up to you to weigh the benefits and negative consequences of your training methods (or any other actions) and decide what you will ultimately choose to do.

We all have our ultimate goals...I want a well behaved dog who is respectful of the other animals in the house and the people living in it, but I also want one who will work with me and for me (Flyball, Obedience and maybe agility more seriously) so I try to maintain what I believe is a relationship of trust and respect with my dog founded on fairness, (to my limitations and his) and consistency.

You'll get a lot of blunt advice here so don't get too offended, just try to take it for what it is...advice given with the interest of your dog in mind.

[zorro13]

A word about grabbing the scruff of the neck, and I don't wany anyone reading that and just go about doing it for everything. With 6 cats here, 5 with claws and differing personalities, the cats don't get a free ride neither, meaning they can't harass the dog/pup neither. Cats have dead on aim, Zorro did get clipped by my one female Jasmine while on leash, right above his eye. I don't need a pup losing an eye. Interesting to note, a pup is quick to notice who has claws and who doesn't. I adhere to a pack structure in this house, these are just my views, with myself at the top of that pack, meaning a pup learns they(cats) are part of the pack family, not prey toys, as I decide that as well. Like anything else, any training technique can be misused and become abusive. Grabbing the scruff of the neck while done by a dam in a non-violent way is the way I have used it as well, it is not used as a form of punishment but it is a correction. I don't like harsh corrections on a leash neither, as Zorro was doing too good of a job on himself at times with this. Hand shy? No, it's more of an immediate attention grabber if anything.

I have a 4 year old neighbor who plays with my dog almost daily. While kids are kids, she constantly likes to try to start a game of chase with him, and she is repeatedly told that the dog isn't allowed to chase children or anybody for that matter, to which he doesn't. He has plenty of toys to chase around, catch, run around with and more than enough play time in general. The world is not his oyster for the picking.

[ReeboksMomForever]

hokisteph5 - I did several searches on chilly bone and quite a few of the reviewers said that their puppies put holes in the chilly bones after a couple of uses. Have you had any problem with this? Just want to check it out before I go get one!

[FenrisUlfr]

Mine put holes in the chilly bone and began ripping out the stuffing in one use.

[ReeboksMomForever]

Thanks FenrisUlfr - the way Tex likes to chew I'm sure it wouldn't take him long to put holes in a Chilly Bone!

[ReeboksMomForever]

Update - I have been using the leash on Tex in the house and outside with the Lab for the past three days and I am telling him to 'leave it' if he goes after the cats or dog and he is getting much better! He is also doing much better with the biting - I know it will take time but at least he's making progress. Thanks for all the advice and sorry I got offended AngelBunny - you were just calling a 'spade' - a 'spade'!