Growling and Showing Teeth!!Help!!

[frontierrots]

Originally Posted by BostonRott

Ok, here are my thoughts, and as we all know, I'm not a warm-fuzzy, sugar-coated person.

A) In *my* experience with well-bred, working line dogs, this is NOT normal. If I had a puppy pulling this crap, it would have gone back to the breeder for temperament problems.

I know you and I've had this discussion before but growling and teeth showing temper tantrums ARE very very common in very young Rott pups, good or poorly bred.
BUT it is NOT common in older pups at all

With work it goes away, with hesitation or tentativeness on the owners part it gets worse

I would not be attending puppy class until Stuart was 12 weeks old. 8 week olds need to be learning home manners and developing social skills with people and above all NOT be exposed to strange puppies

[StuartsMom]

I'm gonna assume everything with him is ok since the vet has already seen him and given him his vaccinations. Hes a vet. The vet advised us to get him into a class asap. He has had his DHLP vaccination, his kennel cough vaccination , and heartworm, worm and flea medicines.

I dont think he was poorly bred since we met his mother, father, etc...
They were very friendly and the breeder we bought him from is in Wisconsin and has been breeding for over 18 years. We have his AKC registration and a DNA tested bloodline..

I do think he is a puppy and all puppies test their limits. If this continues then maybe there is a problem.

I do also understand that we have a lot of work cut out for us, but that's a given when you get a dog that you want to be wellbehaved. I wouldn't be asking questions if I didn't want to get him trained correctly.

Thanks for the ideas.

[JeanT]

Question for Boston Rott: Does what you said about this indicating poor genetic temperment apply only to Rottweiler puppies? The only experience with puppies that I have had is from my sister's dogs and three friends' dogs, all of which I've known from puppyhood through adulthood. Some are mixed, some are pure, none are Rottweilers. And none have gone through formal training. The description I read here sounds to me like what I have seen in early phases of all the puppies. All the adult results are people and dog friendly, though not surprisingly some are not particularly mannerly because of lack of consistent owner training. I've dog-sat most of them at various times and have never seen or people or dog aggression.

I know this is not great depth of experience on my part which is why I am asking you, is this behavior in young Rottweiler puppies of different consequence than in non-Rottweilers?

[BostonRott]

Originally Posted by StuartsMom

I dont think he was poorly bred since we met his mother, father, etc...
They were very friendly and the breeder we bought him from is in Wisconsin and has been breeding for over 18 years. We have his AKC registration and a DNA tested bloodline..

I'm not trying to hijack this thread, but to offer information.

Ethical breeders are forbidden by their breed clubs from selling puppies at 6 weeks old. AKC papers do NOT guarantee quality, they only guarantee that the parents were AKC registered. There are several threads on here regarding what an ethical breeder is or is not.

As well, many vets are NOT current on vaccine protocols or current research. At 8 weeks a puppy is ABSOLUTELY NOT fully vaccinated or protected. If your vet is telling you this, you NEED A NEW VET!

Article on Vaccine protocols

[BostonRott]

Originally Posted by JeanT

Question for Boston Rott: Does what you said about this indicating poor genetic temperment apply only to Rottweiler puppies?

My experience is only with Rottweilers, and the above is only my opinion, based on what I look for in my dogs. I do feel that the severe reactions that this puppy has shown, at this age, indicate faulty temperament. It can hopefully be overcome by consistant training.

[poohbearsmom]

Originally Posted by frontierrots

I know you and I've had this discussion before but growling and teeth showing temper tantrums ARE very very common in very young Rott pups, good or poorly bred.
BUT it is NOT common in older pups at all

With work it goes away, with hesitation or tentativeness on the owners part it gets worse

Absolutely agree, as this has been my experience with a certain dog. I nearly sent him back to the breeder, as his satanic responses really threw me for a loop at first! He grew up to be quite an amicable character.

I would not be attending puppy class until Stuart was 12 weeks old. 8 week olds need to be learning home manners and developing social skills with people and above all NOT be exposed to strange puppies

Actually, I disagree with waiting to start a puppy K until 12weeks of age.

Common sense goes a long way in regards to socialization. I know longtime breeders who still will not take pups off their property until the pups are completely finished with vacs. IMHO, that's too late, and I see what waiting does for the dogs.
The socialization window closes at 12 weeks. While the first few days a new pup is at home should be spent getting to know it's new, once the pup is familiar with it's new family/environment, the pup needs to get out and about and socializing regularly.

Common sense is key in proper socialization. Anywhere a puppy class is held should require proof of vaccination for all dogs that come to the property. If all dogs on premise have been vaccinated, then one stands a very good chance at having the opportunity to do right by the pup with minimal fear of infectious disease.

[SuziHeaton]

Boston Rott said:

"I do agree with your vet, the growling is not good. To me, it indicates bad temperament. You are going to have to work extra hard with this puppy to make sure that he is a good citizen in the canine world. You should stay in training classes with him on a VERY regular basis through his first year."

While I'm no expert, I was thinking the exact same thing as I read your post.

Honestly, I think the growling at 8 weeks is a sign that your pup will need intensive training as he matures. I honestly can't say that I've ever encountered an 8 week old pup who growled like you're describing.

With that said, I still have hopes your pup will mature to become a fine dog! My Sadie required a lot of training (well, strike that, I actually needed the training--it turns out she's actually a very smart dog who is eager to please--her mommy was just a moron who didnt' know how to teach her properly)! I'm convinced that if she can be an awesome dog, most can with proper training.

I also think your puppy socialization class sounds like a good idea. If the dog is growling now, perhaps early socialization can help. I would just beware of the parvo thing and other illnesses. I don't know about all rotties, but I can tell you mine has the most sensitive stomach of any dog I've ever seen. My vet swears this is a common rotty trait, but I don't know if I fully buy that.

Good luck!! Keep us posted on training!

[JeanT]

OK... I must not be envisioning the behavior correctly. One of the communication weaknesses of reading on the internet instead of "being there".

[kelis]

Originally Posted by kayozzy

Don't chase her, that makes it a game to her. You need to teach her drop it with some less valuable items, so that when she grabs something she shouldn't have or dangerous, she'll drop it without it becoming a game. Please read everything you can on here in puppy development and get the book Sharon Marples suggested. Raising a puppy is tough and we can never learn too much!

lol i dont chase her i try and catch her as shes running past me with the desired object that she has chose to steal!! all Puppys do this (not just rotts) they eventually learn what they are allowed to have, but only through perservirence! .. A pup needs to be taught right from wrong and with love and patience, it will.. But i also belive that a pup needs to be a pup and enjoy the learning curves..(without taking his/her puppy hood away ) If the pup has been brought up the right way he/she will be a great credit to the owner!..

P.s iv read and i still read all advice I couldnt ask for a better place to read real experiences and I learn something new everday! Raising a pup isnt tougth if you are willing to learn,are patient and have enougth time to give them the attention they need! oh and are calm and dont mind the smell of puppy breath and farts! not to mention hairy houses!!

Kelis and little maddam Kiya!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[kayozzy]

Originally Posted by kelis

lol i dont chase her i try and catch her as shes running past me with the desired object that she has chose to steal!! all Puppys do this (not just rotts) they eventually learn what they are allowed to have, but only through perservirence! .. A pup needs to be taught right from wrong and with love and patience, it will.. But i also belive that a pup needs to be a pup and enjoy the learning curves..(without taking his/her puppy hood away ) If the pup has been brought up the right way he/she will be a great credit to the owner!..

P.s iv read and i still read all advice I couldnt ask for a better place to read real experiences and I learn something new everday! Raising a pup isnt tougth if you are willing to learn,are patient and have enougth time to give them the attention they need! oh and are calm and dont mind the smell of puppy breath and farts! not to mention hairy houses!!

Kelis and little maddam Kiya!! xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Of course they all do it. It is sooo much fun! Teaching "drop it" doesn't take her puppyhood away, but will help you curb the grab it and run. I agree, all training should be lots of fun for puppies. Behavioral training only. I never tried to catch Xander or grab him while he was on the run. Just waited until he knew I wasn't playing his game and then traded for something like a treat. Drop it was one of the first things we worked on, and you can make that lots of fun, too with the trading game. Then when he tried grab and run, I calmly said "drop it" in a low voice and he knew I would have something better for him if he dropped it.

Sounds like you are doing a great job! Raising a puppy is tough exactly because you need to learn so much, have tons of patience, be calm, and give as much time as possible. I don't know anyone that would describe that as easy to accomplish! We wouldn't call them little terrors if it were easy! LOL It is lots of fun, though!

[kelis]

Originally Posted by kayozzy

Of course they all do it. It is sooo much fun! Teaching "drop it" doesn't take her puppyhood away, but will help you curb the grab it and run. I agree, all training should be lots of fun for puppies. Behavioral training only. I never tried to catch Xander or grab him while he was on the run. Just waited until he knew I wasn't playing his game and then traded for something like a treat. Drop it was one of the first things we worked on, and you can make that lots of fun, too with the trading game. Then when he tried grab and run, I calmly said "drop it" in a low voice and he knew I would have something better for him if he dropped it.

Sounds like you are doing a great job! Raising a puppy is tough exactly because you need to learn so much, have tons of patience, be calm, and give as much time as possible. I don't know anyone that would describe that as easy to accomplish! We wouldn't call them little terrors if it were easy! LOL It is lots of fun, though!

Thank you for your advice and very well put! ..xxxxxxxx

[groupieindenial]

Originally Posted by BostonRott

I do feel that the severe reactions that this puppy has shown, at this age, indicate faulty temperament. It can hopefully be overcome by consistant training.

The fault in the temperament is that of the pup being let go at 6 weeks. Otherwise, the fits, the objections, the un-wilingness to submiss, is just that of a strong willed Rottwieler, like they were meant to be. My Vegas did all this and more!! We had issues at our first vet visit, I switched vets to one he was handled well, and LIKED. Problem solved. He growled, bit me, drew blood on numerous occasions that young. We worked through them. I've had the best trainers evaluate him, and he had no temperament issues. I've been told by several Rottweiler experts that he has a very level temperament, just a LOT of drive, and a cocky little bugger.

IT will take more work than your calm less confident Rottweiler pup, but the rewards supercedes all these hurdles you'll have to overcome. Keep at it, be consistent and follow through - mean what you say.

[Fast4dr]

Wow. You just have to wonder what kind of interaction and/or stimulus your pup received from the breeder. Sad. Really sad.