aggression in 8wk old pup?

[Dimitri]

thanks all, hopefully the dog isn't wired wrong and it was the case of a boob raising the pup. I'm waiting for someone from the dog house to call me back in regards to this. last night i went to my kung fu school and he behaved well though he was woken up from his car ride :D. the one thing i've noticed is that you have to approach him (strangers) from below the head and not above, if you try to pet his head he shys(sp) away and avoids the new person... it almost sounds like an abuse issue...

[Sharon Marples]

Originally Posted by Dimtiri

the one thing i've noticed is that you have to approach him (strangers) from below the head and not above, if you try to pet his head he shys(sp) away and avoids the new person... it almost sounds like an abuse issue...

No, this is not an abuse issue (like so many think). This is a fear/temperament issue.

When you say you are waiting for the dog house to call you back, is that a pet store?

[Dimitri]

http://www.thedoghousetoronto.com/

it is an obiendance school located near my place here in toronto. i have an apt at 5pm today for an overal assessment. i'm keeping my fingers crossed that it is only because of the change in his environment and it could be easily cured with lots of TLC and time. the place and person was recommended to me by my vet

[Sharon Marples]

Originally Posted by Dimtiri

http://www.thedoghousetoronto.com/

it is an obiendance school located near my place here in toronto. i have an apt at 5pm today for an overal assessment. i'm keeping my fingers crossed that it is only because of the change in his environment and it could be easily cured with lots of TLC and time. the place and person was recommended to me by my vet

Great, good luck with the appointment. Let us know what they say.

[HeidiMota]

I too, have an 8 week old and she was raised with 3 children before we brought her home. She is shy of strangers but I read in a book that if you give the stranger a treat, let the puppy smell their hand first, then let the stranger give the puppy a treat, it works with mine. I don't force her, when she smells the treat, she says "okay" and lets them pet her. Also, socializing is crucial at this age and because of Parvo, I don't let my puppies feet touch the ground anywhere but home. However, I do take her places to meet people and experience different sounds. When I take her somewhere like Petco or Home Depot (great for socializing) I put her in the basket and push her around. People "ooh and ahhh" over her. When someone wants to pet her and she's not comfortable, I give the stranger a treat to give to her and it works. Give it a try and remember, Socialize, socialize, socialize!!!

[Dimitri]

Okay after a quick and free examination from the dog trainer and behaviourlist(sp), i'm happy to report that the dog is normal and is not wired wrong LOL. last night my pooch had his first interaction in a puppy socialization class where lots of new owners and other clients of this trainer get together to have their dogs socialize with others in a small area. my dog was somewhat aloof and was good to everyone.

as far as what happened at the vet's office. the trainer said that is normal as the puppy was in new surroundings and had several people handling him all at the same time. now i know how to help him through some new surroundings, i'm getting him ready for puppy school with his first lesson on saturday.
I'll keep posting on his progress and it would just appear that he had a bad first start in life and this is easily corrected at this stage of his life.

[poohbearsmom]

Originally Posted by Dimtiri

Okay after a quick and free examination from the dog trainer and behaviourlist(sp), i'm happy to report that the dog is normal and is not wired wrong LOL. last night my pooch had his first interaction in a puppy socialization class where lots of new owners and other clients of this trainer get together to have their dogs socialize with others in a small area. my dog was somewhat aloof and was good to everyone.

as far as what happened at the vet's office. the trainer said that is normal as the puppy was in new surroundings and had several people handling him all at the same time. now i know how to help him through some new surroundings, i'm getting him ready for puppy school with his first lesson on saturday.
I'll keep posting on his progress and it would just appear that he had a bad first start in life and this is easily corrected at this stage of his life.

Very nice to hear. This is why immediate assistance was so important. Before the age of 12 weeks, many weaknesses can be overcome through proper handling.

Taking him to the vet for fun party visits will likely be suggested. Go armed with tasty tidbits for your pup, and the vet techs.

Looking forward to hearing of your progress.

Cheers

[Zimdude]

#4 02-01-2006, 09:19 AM
scooterjohansen
Member Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: australia

Re: aggression in 8wk old pup?

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reality check... its a puppy 8 weeks old...you expecting way too much. enjoy the furball while you can they grow really quick...
-----------------------------

I love this post. Our little guy is almost 5 months now, and we cant believe how much of a hulk he has grown into. We took a lot of pics, and reflect on them laughing like crazy. The little devil will do a lot ie) he loves to run away whenever he "gets" a hot item, like a piece of paper, and yes he was a biter at first. All we did was grab his muzzle and say no bite. his big thing now is to paw you. I am now seeing that they are a ton of work in the beginning, but well worth it. You will most definitly look back and say, what a little fuzzbal. He was a riot!

[WendiS]

Originally Posted by wildfire

Hi , My ten week old Cochise wasn't like that but he has show some aggression with me at time when we are playing around( me laying watching a little t.v. him playing with my hand) He sometimes gets carried away and wants to bite a little hard on my hand, He knows the NO BITE command. So I tell him OWE!! NO BITE , He sometimes will go to the end of the bed as if to want to still play but he knows he did a bad thing to me but just like a kid he wants to get out of it by trying to play something differant. Well sometimes he barks as if to play but I tell him no ! You hurt me , And try to not pay attention to him ( as he knows) but then he starts barking more and I say No , He comes back loving and does it again , so I tell him the same thing , he then will show his teeth at me as if he is so ticked at me cause I don't want him to bite so hard. I do not yell and scream at him when he does this but I also have to be the boss of this , Right? I am trying to be patient with him but I do not like the way he does this. He does not do it often but enough! When he does this (showing me his teeth as in anger), I then get a DEEP tone and tell him NO BITE Bad boy!! If he continues to do this then I pop his little nose ( not hard ) and tell him NO ! BAD BOY !! Then I wait till he is not showing his teeth at me and then and only then I love on him and tell him he is a good boy and I make it a point to play and love him easy, rubbing and talking , for a time so he knows he is not always boss but I love him dearly !! Can any one tell me if this is the right thing I am doing? I do not want him to be real agressive. He is only ten weeks old but I have had him since he was 5 weeks old. ( his breeder was wanting Christmas money and told every one that they were 7 almost 8 weeks old , I went ahead and got him so he did not end up someone's furious yard dog!!) Since i got him I have told every one not to play rough with him , I do not want him to be mean . I have a 6 year old ( who is tough as they come ) I do not want them hurting each other. ( my 6 yr. old hurting him now and Cochise rembering it and hurting my baby later, as they grow so fast) well please , any good tips would be helpful to my not so timid pup . He is not scared of anything . HE does not run away , he stands guard , but watches , he does not bark unless he see's somthing coming toward him , he then will bark and go forward to it . When he gets scared he stops and growls . But when he figures out it is a person (family ) he runs toward them and running all between their legs and trying to wag his litle tail . He's so cute at these times.

What you're calling aggression is really just a puppy being a puppy, but because he was taken from his siblings too soon he never learned how to play appropriatly. Playing will not make him mean but you will have to show him what his littler mates would have had he stayed with them for the appropriate amount of time. Your saying "oww!" and turning away from his is excactly right. Holding a grudge for an extended period of time or assuming he knows what he did and is trying to get out of it is not. His attention span isn't much longer than your little finger. when he goes away and then comes back that's "I'm sorry, lets try again" just keep it up. If he playes rough do the same thing you did before. If you find yourself loosing patience put him in his crate and both of you take a break. He's only going to be a little guy for such a short time. Enjoy it and don't worry. Puppies are rarely mean (there are exceptions but that's a problem dog and you don't want it anyway) and playing won't make him mean (it will establish how he believes he has the right to treat you though). Keep in mind shouting, popping him on the nose and developing an adversarial relationship won't make him the family companion you must have been looking for when you bought him though. Relax don't worry and it sounds like aside from some misconceptions your doing just fine.

In re reading your post there does seem to be a little attitude going on. Check out NILIF (nothing in life is free) and that should help you get some controll of your little man's attitude. And for me, the minute I saw those lips curl (if indeed he's getting pissy about you not playing with him) I'd set mister man on the floor or put him in his crate and let him know that the bed is for nice dogs. Little snot tots stay on the floor. That's something for you to keep in mind too.
Once you figure out whose incharge it's pretty amazing how quickly they figure it out.
Play stuff- be patient with attitude- don't tolerate for a moment he's young, you guys will get it straightened out. You seem to have good instincts.
Good luck
Wendi

[poohbearsmom]

Originally Posted by Zimdude

#4 02-01-2006, 09:19 AM
scooterjohansen
Member Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: australia

Re: aggression in 8wk old pup?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

reality check... its a puppy 8 weeks old...you expecting way too much. enjoy the furball while you can they grow really quick...
-----------------------------

I love this post. Our little guy is almost 5 months now, and we cant believe how much of a hulk he has grown into. We took a lot of pics, and reflect on them laughing like crazy. The little devil will do a lot ie) he loves to run away whenever he "gets" a hot item, like a piece of paper, and yes he was a biter at first. All we did was grab his muzzle and say no bite. his big thing now is to paw you. I am now seeing that they are a ton of work in the beginning, but well worth it. You will most definitly look back and say, what a little fuzzbal. He was a riot!

There is a big difference between a pup who is full of itself, and a pup that shows fearful responses to environment and people. It's the degree of fear response, and more importantly, whether or not the pup recovers from it's response in good time that is tell tale of what's to come in the future.

This is why having a pup who's having fear issues of any kind be evaluated for these responses/recovery is very important. Left to it's own devices, it would be perfectly 'normal' for a pup not to learn how to recover properly - thus perpetuating the problem, and opening up the door to the dog maturing into a less than confident animal. This is when it can become a major problem.

By having the pup evaluated by qualified people, Dimitri is not only giving a gift to himself, but he's going to learn properly how to give his puppy the ability to enjoy life as it should be - rather than living the next 12 years or so with a dog that is rather unsafe and unpredictable.

Just as with humans, dogs are born with various strengths and weaknesses... learning how to help a pup along properly really sets the stage for the rest of a pup's life.

[wildfire]

Hi Wendi,
Thanks for the advice . I was sure glad to hear I was doing something right. He seems to be doing better . I have only seem his teeth shining at me once since I posted the note. I will try the crate . He seems to know the crate is for two things . 1) when I leave and I can not trust him by himself for that long of time. 2) when he is bad . I ALWAYS make sure he looks at me and I use my bad dog tone to let him know I am NOT HAPPY with him so he has to go in the crate. I do not leave him in there for a long time , I try to only leave him in for about 5-max 10 min. ( usually I get my self busy doing something else so I don't feel so bad about putting him there. ) when I leave him in the crate for a time that I have to be gone , I always talk to him in a baby voice and tell him bye - when I do this at night for potty purposes I always tell him goodnite and he is doing better in his potty training since I started with the crate. He was doing ok with the one area and news papers until he kept messing in my dinning room by climbing over the box I had blocking the entrance.(getting so big) Thanks again for the tip . I love being able to talk to other people about their babies and better ways of raising them so they are not mean when they grow up.

[Sharon Marples]

He seems to know the crate is for two things . 1) when I leave and I can not trust him by himself for that long of time. 2) when he is bad . I ALWAYS make sure he looks at me and I use my bad dog tone to let him know I am NOT HAPPY with him so he has to go in the crate. I do not leave him in there for a long time , I try to only leave him in for about 5-max 10 min. ( usually I get my self busy doing something else so I don't feel so bad about putting him there. ) when I leave him in the crate for a time that I have to be gone , I always talk to him in a baby voice and tell him bye - when I do this at night for potty purposes I always tell him goodnite and he is doing better in his potty training since I started with the crate.

Sorry, but you are not going about crate-training the correct way.

A crate should NEVER be used for punishment! A dog needs to know that his crate is a safe haven, not somewhere he is thrown for being bad. If he needs a time out for some reason, then using a crate is ok, but you never want to use a harsh tone of voice when crating a puppy, he should go into the crate feeling good about it. He should have toys and treats while in the crate. You never want him to have the wrong opinion of his crate.

If you have to correct your puppy, do it verbally and get it over with. When you use a crate for punishment, he has no idea of why he is there. Don't be believing that a dog thinks like a human and knows why you are throwing him into the crate, he does not.

A good verbal correction for any bad behavior is much better than using the crate as your scapegoat.

[Dimitri]

okay update on the puppy's aggression. it would appear that he only snaps when you are trying to rub the side of his face. like you kneed(sp) his side face and neck area and he starts snapping.... as per the trainer, we are going to have to try to desensitize(sp) the pooch and give him gentle careful rubs in that area to show the dog that we are not going to hurt him, but shower him with lots of TLC and that is it okay for us to play with him...

I hope to have some photos of his socialization period from last night by next week. one huge improvement is that his tail was high up in the air and he was participating more with the other dogs. I really starting to see improvements with the dog and he is starting to get less nervous with each and every passing day. I suppose all those trips to home depot to get various products are helping the boob

[gnwhite]

as far as the crate issue, i agree with the other post. we never use it for punishment, it's used for naps during the day and sleeping at nite.

if a firm no and redirecting does'nt work, then we baby gate him in the hallway, we are in our living room and he can see us very well. we then totally ingore him for about 15 minutes. this works great for us.

good luck, norma

[NImba]

I have a 3.5 month old now but when I got her, she was very neutral, not shy, not agressive. She soon got comfortable and started testing her limits. She was trying to find out who Alpha dog was so I had to constantly remind her she was not it. I still do occationaly. I read a few books on Rotties and found it is natural for them to test out their limits so when she'd start testing hers, I'd quickly remind her by putting her on her back (like mom wolf/dog would do when their puppies would get out of line). She would go from growling, biting, crazy dog to "...oops, I realize I was out of line, sorry". Worst case, I would ignore her if she was really bad because the thing that she wants most is attention and play. When I took that away from her, she adjusted her behavior to do whatever she had to do to get that attention and play back. Your rottie will challenge you often! Find out what works best for your pup so that when he does challenge you, you can let him know that what he just did is not ok. Stay on top of it because he will do it often!! Now, at 35 months, she is much better and reraly do I have to "check" her attitude. She now knows what kind of behavior gets her the attention she wants and the play sessions she craves.

Good luck!

(My Rottie is the best thing that ever happened to me and I couldn't immagine being without her now! Hopefully you can create yourself a partner like that.)