Puppy Training

[RisingStar]

Hi i was wondering if i could get some advice on training.
I have a 4 month old Rott/Lab mix puppy. We did
the puppy class training and hes good with most of his
commands. problem is that he still pulls me and does
lunging. We did the loving kind of training for lack of better
word. Now a more advanced trainer is telling me that he
needs much more disipline in his training. Also a pinch or choke
collar. Will it be ok to use two diff. training methods or will
it only confuse him? Also what do you all think about the gentle
lead system. By the way we adopted bear from a shelter at 8 weeks.
They told me he was a lab feista mix so he would be real small
much to my surprise hes now 50 pounds with the head of a rotten puppy Anyway thx so much for any advice.

[Judi W]

Well, if you are concerned about confusing him more than you are about being drug down the street............. At 4 months of age, he is old enough to start learning that not all things are optional. He isn't going to get any younger or any smaller. There is nothing wrong with a pup learning that different things are required of him as he matures.

[Maryn306]

I've never used a prong or choke collar...YET ;)

I also recently took in a rescue Rott mix, 4 1/2 mos old. We are working on pulling on leash. It's pretty simple really. When you walk with him and he starts to pull...pull back. If he keeps it up, jerk and stop, and put him in a sit.. don't let him proceed. If he's very stubborn about it and not getting the message, wrap the leash around your hand until it's very short and he has no choice but to be next to you and use the pull/jerk and stop. Make sure you verbalize at least a firm 'NO' when he pulls and you pull back or jerk and stop. I've done this with an unruly Lab, GSD, Pit, and Cane Corso and had great results. My lil Rottie is getting the message as well :)

[Luvs]

I personally would not be jerking a young puppy. But then I don't jerk my adult dogs either.

Your puppy has no idea that you don't want him to pull you down the street, because he has been allowed to do this. He has to learn that pulling is NOT going to get him anywhere. So, when he starts pulling, stop all forward movement and don't begin walking again until he is no longer pulling. Don't say anything while while he is pulling. Wait until he is no longer pulling and then praise and start walking again.
If you do this EVERY time he starts to pull, he will soon learn that pulling doesn't do any good

[Maryn306]

You don't have to viciously jerk his neck or anything Luvs. But these dogs are a large dominant breed, and at this age they are ready to start learning the big boy way. My boy is still new to our home and 'pack', so I do revolve mostly around positive reinforcement with him because it is important that he trust me and feel comfortable and get settled. But I want there to be no quirps about who's the boss either. You can wait a few minutes until the dog decides to stop pulling, or you can stop and give a jerk back to get his attention and break the pull. I prefer to get his attention right off the bat.

[Judi W]

Maryn, I've never heard of such a method.

In general we do not want to teach a dog that the partnership is about who is heavier or stronger and can pull the hardest.

Not sure what "loving" training is all about but if it means never making the pup do something, then yes, it might be a bit uncompatible with your next level class. Stay signed up and in classes for the next few years. You will be amazed at how smart your dog is and what a pleasure it is to have a partnership with your dog. It really is not possible to each a class on the forum, There is too much that has to be observed. We can talk alot on specifics, but you still need to be in class.

[Maryn306]

Judi..perhaps I'm giving the wrong impression of what I mean by pull. I do NOT mean to literally pull the dog backwards out of his pulling, I'm not in the practice of gagging or harming any dog. But to pull back your arm, and hold tight to give more resistance to his forward pulling. When a dog is pulling you on lead, most times the persons arm is extended outward and straight to hold on, I pull it back so that it is bent at a 90 degree angle with the top of my arm against my side and tense up. If the dog is being stubborn, or too interested in something it is after to stop pulling, at that point I will jerk my forearm up and closer to me to get his attention. Simultaneously I give a 'No, Sit', before proceeding. It isn't bullying or who can pul lthe hardest at all.

[Judi W]

This is what I read: "When you walk with him and he starts to pull...pull back."

[Maryn306]

Yes..and I apologize for being vague. In my mind I knew what I meant...but being that you aren't in there with my thoughts, I shouldn't expect you to know what I mean :)

[RisingStar]

Thanks so much for all the good advice. I took him for a walk and things went much better :) As far as a loving class it seemed that way compared to this advanced trainer. Bear was pulling some on the leash so the trainer took the leash to show me how to control his pulling. He snapped the leash back so.... hard Bear yelped.
Im afraid this is my first experience with training and dogs . So i dont know what
works or not with a dog. I bought a book on rotts and Have looked up everything i can find on the breed so i can do this right. So far its been quite an experience :) Anyway
thank you all so much for the help.

[Maryn306]

Originally Posted by RisingStar

Bear was pulling some on the leash so the trainer took the leash to show me how to control his pulling. He snapped the leash back so.... hard Bear yelped.

And that's how NOT to do that.

Maybe the classes you attend now are all about Positive Reinforcement? The trainer here that hubby and Rocco will be going to for obedience only uses PR. She is a great lady, and wonderful trainer. One of the local PDs uses her to train their K-9s.

[Luvs]

Originally Posted by RisingStar

Bear was pulling some on the leash so the trainer took the leash to show me how to control his pulling. He snapped the leash back so.... hard Bear yelped.
Im afraid this is my first experience with training and dogs.

Yikes! There is no reason to cause pain or fear to get the results you desire. If you see something being done to your dog that you do not feel comfortable with, do NOT hesitate to say something. He is your dog and YOU decide what can and cannot be done with him. Your instructor seems a little harsh for my taste, but that is just me.


Everyone of us was new at one time or another. You are doing the right thing by taking classes and asking questions. That is the best way to learn!

[wagondog]

Luvs,
There should never be pulling when using a prong type coller. When fitted properly and used correctly it is a quick snap from a loose leash position followed by the verbal command that you have taught the meaning of. Far to many people get into pulling matches with their dogs to no avail. You should also determine the level of correction your dog needs and responds to. Use the least amount of correction necessary to get the results you want.

You asked about the gentle leader (haltie?) for you dog. Am I the only one here that feels the haltie can give a large pulling dog cervical damage. No one responded to the question, unless I missed it.......

[Judi W]

No you are not. Have posted that and links to Clothier's site on it so many times.........

[wagondog]

With all the knowledge coming from this forum, I just knew there would have been some discussion on halties. I have only been a forum participant for several weeks and probably missed your haltie comments. I'm going to search them out.
thanks