Calcium Phosphorus Ratio

[Maxxx]

I know the ideal ratio is 1:1 for a growing puppy, but I am interested in a kibble that has 1.45% calcium to 0.96% phosphorus. Max is 8 1/2 months old. Should I wait until he's fully grown to switch and continue feeding a large breed puppy food?

He's not doing so well on the Orijen, constantly loose stools so I'm looking to switch to something else. He's finishing up his third 30lb bag and the poop situation has not improved

[brunie's mom]

For a large breed puppy 1:1 is ideal...for small breeds it does not matter as much.
I would wait till he is older to put him on the food with the high calcium....at least 12 months.

How much Orijen are you feeding? Have you tried cutting back the amount you feed? Another good Canadian food is Go Natural ....it's not grain free...but they have a Salmon& Oatmeal, as well as Chicken & Rice.

Have you tried any of the other American made foods such as Canidae or Innova, or California Natural?

Gina

[Maxxx]

He was weaned on the puppy Innova and when we got him, switched to the Canidae ALS which gave him lots of eye boogies and loose stools. We switched to the large breed Orijen and are feeding him between 2 1/4-2 1/2 cups each meal so about 5 cups a day. I play around with those amounts depending on how he looks. A bit more if he's looking thin and vice versa.

I've been lessening the amount of treats he gets, and so the 5 cups a day is pretty close to what he gets in total. If I know hubby's been feeding him treats during the day, I'll only feed him 2 cups for dinner.

Should I drop to 2 cups each feeding and see how that goes?

I was thinking of the large breed Innova as the next one to try....

[brunie's mom]

WOW!!! That's a lot of food!
Why don't you try cutting back. I know that Orijen is high in calories..I think you are over feeding him. He's still growing, but the major growth is almost done and he does not need all of those calories.

In all of the foods I fed to Baxter when he was a puppy...Canidae or Innova...I never fed him more than 3 cups per day. Baxter's on the Adult Orijen now for the last 3-4 months and he only eats 2 1/2 cups in total all day. Mind you he is 4 years old, but an active 115 lbs dog.

I would probably cut him back to about 3 cups per day...for sure no more than 4 cups.
I see this as a very common problem, when dogs are overfed, they often have loose stools. Give it a try.

Gina

[Maxxx]

Thanks Gina I will!

I think I'll drop him to 2 cups a feeding and see how it goes for a couple of days. If it's still loose, I'll keep dropping a 1/4 every few days and monitor the poop situation. Wow, he's going to be in for a big surprise over the next few days! He's a food monster! LOL

[brutus'mother]

I loudly echo what Gina said.
My dog is 108 pounds at 15 months, very active, and was only getting a total of 4 cups of Orijen (2 cups am 2 cups pm).
That amount held him very nicely, he has lots of muscle but is still pretty lean.
Orijen is an awesome kibble. I hope cutting back helps the stools.
Good Luck

[brunie's mom]

I just took a look at the Orijen website...and you have been overfeeding him.
LB Puppy Orijen is 483 calories per cup...and you have been feeding him that times 5....that's almost 2,500 calories! No wonder he's been pooping big time!

On the website it says for pup's between 3-9 months, weighing from 65-90 lbs should eat only 33/4 cups to41/2 cups in total per day....and I always feed less then the recommended amounts on the back of the bag.

I would think 4 cups or less will be more than enough for him. I think your problems will be solved with less food.

I had a young Bullmastiff bitch that would come to board...and the owner's kept bringing for her Gastro canned food...because they were also seeing loose, frequent poops. I know that they wanted me to feed her too much food (it was Orijen also). When I cut her back to 3 cups per day...she did not need the extra Gastro food to firm things up anymore.

Gina

[IJF1]

Originally Posted by brunie's mom

WOW!!! That's a lot of food!
Why don't you try cutting back. I know that Orijen is high in calories..I think you are over feeding him. He's still growing, but the major growth is almost done and he does not need all of those calories.

In all of the foods I fed to Baxter when he was a puppy...Canidae or Innova...I never fed him more than 3 cups per day. Baxter's on the Adult Orijen now for the last 3-4 months and he only eats 2 1/2 cups in total all day. Mind you he is 4 years old, but an active 115 lbs dog.

I would probably cut him back to about 3 cups per day...for sure no more than 4 cups.
I see this as a very common problem, when dogs are overfed, they often have loose stools. Give it a try.

Gina

I agree. My adult bitch probably only gets 2 cups per day, as an active 82lb adult.

[Maxxx]

Hi Gina, that's really odd. On the bag, the feeding instructions say "Expected Adult Weight", with Adult in bold letters. That's why I was feeding him 5 cups a day. If I went to the expected weight of 85-130lbs, for a 3-9 month old pup, it says between 4 1/2-5 1/2 cups a day. I figured I was right in there feeding around 4 1/2 - 5 cups. I wonder why they have 2 different feeding instructions? I did think it weird that you had to guesstimate your pups eventual weight though.... ~shrug~

Either way, Max is getting 2 cups a feeding now and we'll see what happens in a few days. Hopefully I can report back positive news since I do like Orijen. Thanks again!

[Ayoka]

Originally Posted by brunie's mom

Another good Canadian food is Go Natural ....it's not grain free...but they have a Salmon& Oatmeal, as well as Chicken & Rice.

Petcurean (the Go! people) do have a grain free food out called NoW! Amino Acids in Pet Food

[Maxxx]

Update: Max is down to 4 cups a day and his stools are nice and firm. I feed him 1 3/4 cups in the morning and hubby gives him a small 1/4 cup at lunch in his kong and then 1 3/4 cups at dinner and 1/4 cups just before bed. I found he'd throw up at 5:30 in the morning if I didn't feed something right before bed.

He's grown a bit over the past few days and he's really lean now. I can see the last 2 ribs and he's got a waist any woman would die for!

Thanks again for the advice! I went out and bought another bag of Orijen. I'm also going to ween out any wheat in his diet, I don't think his stomach does well with wheat.

[brunie's mom]

Glad to hear this! If you want to get him away from anything with wheat...you really have to check all the bisquits and treats you are feeding. Milkbone cookies are almost all wheat. Any of those other treats like Snausages, Bacon Bites,etc., all have wheat. You have to read the ingredients on almost everything.

Gina

[Maxxx]

I've only ever given him premium treats, no milkbones or snausages for my baby boy Hubby came home with a package of snausages and I "convinced" him to donate them to the humane society.

I've got him on Wellness Pure Rewards and Dick Van Patten's Potato and Duck right now. I bought some Zeke's Training treats, but those have oats and barley in them, so once those are gone, I'm not getting more. No wheat, oats, barley, corn or soy in his diet. The more I'm switching out, the better his poos are and the less eye boogies he has.

More and more, I'm thinking of just making him treats. That way I can control everything he ingests! I have OCD