Raw Diet

[brutus'mother]

I'm still trying to learn as much as I can about feeding raw. For those of you that follow the raw prey model....is there a book, web site, refrence guide that you followed? (I did join a yahoo group about feeding raw and have found lots of good links).

Do you supplement at all?

Where do you get the meat...grocery store, butcher, costco?

Did you FEEL ready when you started feeding raw, like you knew what you were doing?

Where do you feed? I can't imagine my dog eating a chicken carcass out of a bowl...do they drag it around the kitchen?

No veggies or carbs...it all balances out in the end?

Was there a transition period ie, loose stools, GI upset (puking)?

Is it comparable cost wise? Kibble vs. Raw

Any answers would be appreciated. Thanks

[Da05128]

I was nervous when I started to feed raw - I knew that kibble had complete balanced nutrition for my dog and it was a little scary to take on providing that myself.

I phoned my breeder and we had a very long talk about raw, how to feed, what to feed, how much etc. She also recommended the book about raw by Ian Billinghurst as a resource - she was a huge support and has answered every question I've had.

In the beginning I bought pre-prepared frozen patties that contained a meat/veggie/bone mix. Gradually, I switched over to preparing my own and I find that much more cost effective. I buy a ground meat, bone, and organ mix from a holistic health food supplier. I can get beef, buffalo, chicken, or turkey - for a 5kg block it runs about $20. I order my chicken backs and turkey necks from a local butcher shop - you don't pay much for those...about $1 or less per pound.

I buy veggies from the market - spinach, cale, cucumber, berries etc. and run those through a food processor - I do quite a bit up and then freeze. I also add sardines, plain yogurt, cottage cheese, eggs - not all the time, I mix it up. I do add Vit C, glucosamine, a K9 greens supplement, and an omega 3 supplement everyday.

Cost wise it may be a bit more expensive but not much. Initially I found it to be more work but once I got into a routine it was no problem.

I feed my guys in their crates - that was the easiest and cleanest way to do it. One of my boys loved to run with his chicken parts into the middle of the living room and eat there - not OK :) This way it contains the mess and is easy to clean.

[brutus'mother]

Da05128-ah, let the confusion begin. You mention veggies and ground bone, etc According to what I have read you don't NEED to give any veggies and the suggestion is do not give ground bone-give the carcass-let them eat it. I'm beginning to think it would be safer to stick with kibble.

[AngelBunny]

I fed kibble up until June 26, 2007 when my vet suggested putting our foster on a raw diet due to faiure to thrive on premium kibble.

I buy frozen Oma's Pride, supplemented by what friends give me in terms of freezer burned raw meat, deer organs and such from hunter friends, and organs and meat from friends who raise and slaughter animals. I'm also looking into seeing if I can buy meat from small local slaughter houses.

I did alot of research before switching to raw, reading many website pulled up by a search on raw diet for dogs. I also am a member of a Yahoo! rawfeeding group for dogs and cats.

Every dog eats from a bowl outside, out of eyesight of each other. I have fed raw in the house, tho when I do it's more often patty-type meat and not necks, say, because the dogs pull their food out of their bowls. Sometimes they shake the neck or whatever it is and I don't want meat juice splattering around.

I follow the raw prey model which means no fruits, veggies, or cereal-type food. However, I will give the dogs a piece of my bannana, apple, orange, or whatever else I'm eating more as a treat than anything.

Is it more expensive? Probabably slightly, tho I've never sat down and figured it out with a calculator. I fed premium kibble and am a firm believer in You are what you eat. I also try to eat well, so I'm not about to cut corners on feeding my dogs.

For the three I'm feeding, there was no transition period. All took to raw immediately and there were no long term problems with vomiting, loose stools, gas, or other issues. (From time to time, the dogs' stools might be looser than usual if their meal is all organ meat, say, but that's gone when the next meal is, say duck necks and sardines.)

I confess to being nervous when I fed raw, worried that the dogs weren't getting "proper" supplements, et al. This was more because I was brainwashed by kibble manufacturers than anything else. I believed this at the time and believe it even more, now that the dogs have been eating raw for eight months. The fact of the matter if the diet is correct to begin with there's no need for supplements.

Every personal dog in the future will be fed raw. I've long believed it's the best diet for our canine companions, but I never made the switch because I believed I didn't have time. It was our foster's absolute miserable condition on kibble that prompted me to finally act on my beliefs.

You'll need a freezer and a scale. I was using an old kitchen scale, but it was a pain, so DH bought me a digital scale. I love it.

An extra fridge is nice, too. Helps with all the thawing and storing.

[Da05128]

Originally Posted by brutus'mother

Da05128-ah, let the confusion begin. You mention veggies and ground bone, etc According to what I have read you don't NEED to give any veggies and the suggestion is do not give ground bone-give the carcass-let them eat it. I'm beginning to think it would be safer to stick with kibble.

I know - I follow the plan of 75% meat and 25% veggies. I buy the blocks of ground meat/bone/organ because the most important thing I was told when feeding raw was to feed a variety of protein sources. I do feed them chicken carcass, turkey necks, lamb neck bones, and whole herring in addition to and in rotation with the ground meat.

As with any switch in diet I would use your dogs condition as a guide. My dogs are thriving on raw. The reason I switched was that one of my males had constant loose stools no matter what kibble I fed. When I switched to raw the problem vanished - there was no adjustment period - his stool firmed up immediately and we haven't had a problem in over a year.

I think, like anything else, you have to do your research and then follow your instincts. I wouldn't be comfortable not feeding the way I feed with veggies and supplements but obviously there are lots of dogs that are thriving on the raw prey model - like AngelBunny's dogs. I can tell you without a doubt that I will never feed kibble again - to me there is no comparison in putting down a feed bowl with fresh meat, veggies, and yogurt compared to a scoop of kibble

[brutus'mother]

Thanks for the responses. I'm pretty determined to make the switch so I will continue to do some research until I feel like I atleast am somewhat knowledgable.

[AngelBunny]

Good luck.

Take the plunge.

I'm very glad I did!

[s1960]

Take a look at Esmond Rottweilers website, she lays out her full diet for you. A bag of Evo cost me $1.72 a pound today. I've paid .69 cents a pound for whole chickens, .99 cents a pound for game hens, .89 cents a pound for leg quarters. Whatever is on sale. Fish oil, vitamin e, vitamin c, add a little cost but not that much. Beef heart is $1.49 a pound, Ground turkey is $1.49 a pound. Fish is a little pricie except for sardines and mackerel. I've been using canned tripe which is about 2.00 dollars a can, but I only give a little at a time to mix in his supplements. Liver (Chicken and beef) is cheap enough that I don't even remember what I pay. Knuckle bones and turkey necks dont cost much. So for myself its been quite a bit cheaper then premium kibble. And when I do give fruits or vegetables I use small jars of baby food, .42 cents at Walmart.

[MikeT66]

I too am thinking about feeding my puppy a raw diet. It there anything wrong with just one of his 3 meals a day being the raw diet (dinner meal?). I have been feeding the breakfast meal of dry kibble with a tablespoon of plain yogurt. The lunch meal usually just dry kibble and the dinner meal of dry kibble (with a tablespoon full of canned food or half a tin of sardines or half a cup of green beans). But I was thinking of making the evening meal a raw diet meal 2 or 3 times a week. In between meals as a treat I give Ryker a couple baby carrots or a couple slices of apple. Am I doing right? Thanks for any help and suggestions you can give.

[Kandi]

I will be purchasing the K-9 Kraving raw diet for my girls this week. Finally went and bought a freezer, mostly for their raw diet foods. I didn't think that 30 lbs for $55 seemed like such a bad price to pay, considering what I pay for kibble. But, I admit, that I will only be putting the one girl on it to start.

[TrinaJ]

Jett gets fed outside in her bowl. She LOVES chicken necks and how cheap are they

Jett is the first dog i fed raw, this was advised to me by her breeder. She's been breeding rotties for 20 odd years so i took all of what she said on board. Prior to that i was feeding kibble and table scraps. Now i feed raw meat (kangaroo, lamb, beef, chicken necks - haven't gone the carcass yet i dunno if i can do it!!) She also gets table scraps on the odd occassion, there isn't much left after hubby gets to it!

She's got a great coat, clear eyes and the stools are compact, less and not stinking to high heaven!

[brutus'mother]

Are there certain types of RMB's that you stay away from? I hate to assume anything at this point, but I'm thinking you don't give chicken legs? I know I'm basically asking to be spoon fed here (please bear with me). Would anyone who is feeding the raw prey model diet care to give me a sample of what they feed in any 24 hour period?

[TrinaJ]

Jetts diet (she is 4 1/2 MONTHS old)

Breakfast 2 x wheetbix (breakfast cereal) with goats milk

Morning Tea : Can sardines, Eagle Pack Holistic Puppy kibble (1 cup), cottage cheese

Lunch: Lamb shank/chicken necks

Dinner: Eagle Pack Holistic Puppy Kibble(1 cup), raw meat (either beef/lamb/kangaroo/necks), 3 table spoons yoghurt, desert spoon olive oil

Supper: Goats milk mixed in with a little honey

1 vitamin c table daily and 2 eggs a week

This was the suggest diet by her breeder until she reaches 9 - 12 months of age. After that i will contact her for suggestions.

[s1960]

I feed about 2 1/2 pounds to my 100 Lb. dog. This morning he had a chicken leg quarter that was a little over a pound and some organs,(liver,heart,gizzard) Tonight he will have 1Lb of ground turkey, some tripe and 400iu vit.e,500mg ester c, a table spoon of apple cider vinegar and some acidophilus. His RMB's are mostly chicken, cornish game hen, and Turkey necks. When I first started I bought one of those old hand meat grinders and ground up the chicken bones and all. After a while with necks and backs he seemed to get the Idea on how to crush and tear the pieces so now I give him intact parts and let him enjoy the chewing. In the beginning I was a little unsure so I used Honest Kitchen dehydrated and Natures Variety to get him weaned off the kibble. Did you look at Esmonds Diet?

[AngelBunny]

Originally Posted by brutus'mother

Are there certain types of RMB's that you stay away from?

I haven't been feeding the raw prey model long enough (only since June 26, 2007) to be fearful about what bones I feed--I'm still looking for a slaughter house where I can get beef, goat, lamb, and pork. I might have a concern about rib bones and should I get any, I'd watch the dog who had them carefully. (I'd only give them to one dog at a time, since our two personal dogs and the foster are all fed out of eye sight of each other--one in the front yard, two on opposite sides of the house.)

I also haven't fed turkey drumsticks.

Originally Posted by brutus'mother

I hate to assume anything at this point, but I'm thinking you don't give chicken legs?

Haven't fed these either, but if I had the opportunity to feed turkey and chicken drumsticks, I'd probably take my heavy duty meat cleaver and whack them into much smaller pieces.

Originally Posted by brutus'mother

Would anyone who is feeding the raw prey model diet care to give me a sample of what they feed in any 24 hour period?

I feed by weight, so I weigh everything on a digital scale, zeroing out the bowl.

Thawing and thawed today were duck necks, a 5-lb bag of tripe, and a bag of 6" sardines.

Mox detests sardines, so she got tripe and necks. And a bit of beef marrow to add oil to her coat.

Sailor, the foster boy and our other dog, Tula, both got tripe, necks, sardines, and a piece of beef marrow.

All the dogs will get this until one of the above is gone. Before that happens I'll take out something else to thaw.

I often feed the same thing for a couple of days running before an item runs out. I take the approach that everything balances out in the long term, so feeding a wide variety of fowl, fish, meat, and bone is important.