For those who feed raw...

[gomer9855]

Where do you get your organ meats? I have been to every butcher and abatoire (sp?) within an hour of my house, none of them get organ meat. One butcher will grind chicken backs for me, another will grind beef heart. That's all I can find.

Anyone with an suggestions?

[BostonRott]

I personally would not feed liver or kidneys..........they are the garbage disposals of the body (they are filter organs) and all the nasty toxins, drugs, etc that were ever given to the animal will reside there. Beef heart sounds just fine.

[gomer9855]

Would beefheart and chicken backs be enough meat sources though?

I read on a webpage about feeding a raw, pureed veggie mix too, as well as cottage cheese, yogurt, etc.

I know it can't be recket science to feed a dog. I don't get every nutrient I need in every meal, that's why we have to eat a variety. Same would be true with dogs, right?

[brunie's mom]

There is a bit of science to feeding a raw diet...and you really should read some books, go to some websites and even join some BARF feeders lists.

The dog should have more then chicken backs and beef heart. You can feed ground beef (but need to add calcium to the mix), also lamb and pork and rabbit if you can get some. Beef heart is good...but watch out...feed very little at the beginning...tummy may be upset.

Veggies and fruit should also be part of the mix, as well as eggs and fish,etc.

As far as getting a variety of different meats...I hear you. We have a hard time getting different things at reasonable prices here...and to feed two large dogs.. just too expensive to feed a complete raw diet.

I feed a rotation of good quality kibble (Canidae, Innova, California Natural, Timber Wolf Organics) and feed about 2-3 BARF meals per week. Yesterday the dogs had canned makeral and eggs for dinner with some steamed veggies.

Tues. they may get a dinner of chicken necks and backs, and some canned pumpkin. Is it a complete balanced meal???
Probably not...but I know that they are getting all of the vitamins and minerals,etc. in their kibble meal...so if one meal is not completely balanced, it does not matter.

Feeding a completey balanced raw diet takes alot of study and time. You should really make a spread sheet...figure out what each food contains as far as protein, fat, vitamins, minerals,etc. and then figure out what an adult dog needs and what a growing pup needs.
I do know of a few people that thought feeding chicken backs and some veggies everyday to their dogs was all they had to do..it resulted in their dogs having zinc shortages, iron deficiencies,etc. Dog's coats started getting really poor, and one bitch could not get pregnant.

Gina

[gomer9855]

Eesh. I don't put that much effort into my own meals.

I think I'll stay with the kibble and just give raw food a few times a week like you do. Then if we have to go away for the weekend or have someone else watch the dogs, they won't have to diddle around with the raw and that.

You had any experience with home-cooking meals for them? Be the same idea, I would think, just cooked instead of raw. Frau was on a home diet for a few months when she was a pup. She LOVED it, as opposed to picking here and there like she does now with the kibble.

[hannahjoe]

I fed raw daily to my dogs, have been doing this for years now and the dogs of course love it. I feed chicken backs in the morning and a variety of meats and veggies at night. I buy it already made up, the meat mixture that is. I feed BRAVO, it's very good. So some nights they get chicken and veggies, some nights lamb and veggies, turkey and veggies, venison, duck, buffalo, etc. and then I add supplements, plus yogurt a few times a week, eggs a few times a week, some canned mackrel or sardines maybe twice a week and of course beef and beef hearts maybe once or twice a week. Variety is the key as well as knowing what supplements to give. My guys do awesome on the raw diet and I feel better doing this for them than just opening a bag of food and giving it to them.
It does take some research though knwing what to give and how much, but it's really pretty easy once you get the hang of it.

Lisa

[yogi53]

hannahjoe, do you fed any kibble with BRAVO? I live on the same street as Bogners who manufacturers BRAVO and have considered changing to it but we are happy feed Natures Variety Prairie....I need to learn more about BRAVO

[hannahjoe]

No I do not feed any kibble, it really defeats the purpose of feeing the RAW diet. When you first start out you can feed some kibble, but once the dogs are on RAW for a bit, you should wein them off.

[dkkris]

Liver and kidneys are very good organ meats to feed your dog. They are filter organs but do not store the toxins merely filter them and expel them. They are an excellent source of iron and vitamins which makes them an important part of your raw diet.

[tmatty]

Feeding raw is not all that difficult, but I do understand that it is not for everyone. And the science of a raw foods diet has already been figured out by someone else. The BARF diet is very easy to understand and if you go to their website there is even a formula to figure out how much of each ingredient to feed based on the ideal weight for your dog. As far as iron and zinc deficiencies, that is why the supplements are so important. Kelp, alfalfa, fish and flax oil, ester C, glucosamine, garlic, vitamin E. All of these should be added to the raw diet. Yogurt or Kefir is added for the active cultures. As far as finding a variety of organ meats, there is a line of dog food called Wysong(they also have a website and a raw version of their product)that sells canned meats with nothing else in the can. It comes in chicken, beef, turkey, rabit, venison, and duck. The Wysong products are 100% organic/holistic, human grade food. If BARFing is not for you, check out the Wysong website.

[Platzz]

A good way to start would be to stay with the kibble and start adding some raw veggies & meat(reduce kibble of course). 6 mos old pups can handle chicken necks & wings. I have a source for duck necks. I just feed the necks as is. I also feed green tripe. You can find this frozen or freeze dried. I prefer frozen. Warning this is "outside" food.

[BostonRott]

I've fed BRAVO for years and been very happy with it. There's a co-op up here that buys in bulk, so that we can get the 500lb discounted price.

[groupieindenial]

Hey, where are you in ON? Have you decided to go raw, or not? Depending where you are, I may be able to hook you up with meat, for .60/lb. PM me, I'm not sure why I can't PM you.

I was gonna do it at one point, but it is by no means cheap to do so. It is difficult to do, and keep it balanced because as already indicated, that any prolonged lack of vital nutrients will result in disease and ailments. A holistic food, naturally preserved, and quality ingredients will be more than enough for your dog.

Actually, I believe (and many canine nutrition experts ) that dogs can not digest plant matter in a fashion that they can absorb the nutrients from it. FOr one, they have a short digestive track, and they digest things differently than we do. Their primarily carnivores, and werent meant to eat a diet consisting of 30-40% raw plant matter. In the wild they ate intestines of animals, which meant that the plant matter was already broken down, partially digested, but still only accounted for a small portion of thier diet. Its a mute point, because dogs were "scavengers" and ate WHATEVER they could. Didn't mean they were at their optimal health when they existed in the wild.

I do believe there can be a right ways, or better ways to feed raw, I don't think the general barf way is it. JMO. SO in the meantime, quality kibble seems to me the right choice, because the plant matter is finely ground up, so that there are no cellular walls left.

If your going to feed the odd raw meal, don't mix it with your kibble feed it completely on its own. I didn't believe this at first, but once I did it, and my dog later that night, puked up the meat ONLY, and the kibble got digested fine. Weird, but I guess that notion is true.

[tmatty]

The fruit & veggie mixture I use is off the recommended list on the BARF site, but it does have to be broken down. I first shred the root veggies and then puree everything into a slury. You do have to watch the amount you give them because if you feed to much it can make the stool soft. The slury is easily frozen and I can make 3 to 4 weeks of the mixture in advanced. For the green tripe, there is a company out of Surrey BC, that sells it canned and they also have a website. I think it is called "Triplet". And dogs are omnivorous, pretty much like we are, but their dietary needs and ability to digest certain things differ from humans slightly. That's why any change in diet has to be gradual and the dogs body response needs to be monitored durring the change over, so that adjustments can be made. The trick is to find the optimum balance for your dog. That goes for processed foods as well.

[gomer9855]

I live in wallaceburg. My PM was turned off (I didn't realize you had to turn it on). I gave the dogs their first raw meal tuesday night. They each got a chicken leg (whole thing) 'just to see'. Frau wanted nothign to do with it and Fuast licked it about 10 min, then ate it. I took Frau's away and gave her kibble, which she ate.

The next day I get home from work and Faust had the poops EVERYWHERE. Her crate was full of it, it was all over the wall, my couch, the floor, she was COVERED in it. She went outside, crate and all and got a very throrough bath. She back to solid poop now, but I've only given her kibble.

I read that this could happen with the switch, but MAN IT WAS GROSS! And Everywhere! And STINK! ICK!

So...I dunno now.