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International Rottweilers Africa, Antarctica, Asia, Australia, Europe, North America, South America. As diverse as the world is, we share a common link, the "Rottweiler", here's the place to share as well as experience that link.

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  #1  
Old 09-02-1999, 12:57 AM
Gustavo
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Steroids

I have been reading a lot that dogs'owners are using steroids to give them bigger muscles. Especially some famous dogs. I do not know what to say , but i have never seen such strong dogs like jenneck's ones ,moritz and others . They are really strong. I send an e-mail to the owner of the kennel - Eckart - and he kindly replied that the secret is genetics. Is that true ? Because i am a living prove that this is not true . I think that hard work would get things even against genetics.

What do you guys think??
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  #2  
Old 09-02-1999, 01:57 AM
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Join Date: Oct 1998
First the dogs that you mentioned are all very strong boned. Steriods can not improve on that. Second these dogs are worked and conditioned. Third they are feed very well. They are treated as an athelet which they are. Genetics does go along way, but the conditioning and food plays into this as well. They produce offspring that are very similar and steriods would have no effect on that. These dogs come from lines that produce this type of muscle mass. I personaly don't believe that steriods are used on these dogs.

Now if you see a dog that has type of muscle mass yet his offspring is always lacking then I would wonder.

[This message has been edited by Orville Story (edited September 02, 1999).]
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  #3  
Old 09-02-1999, 11:16 AM
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Join Date: Nov 1998
Gustavo,
I don't know of any reputable ethical breeder using anabolic steroids and/or growth hormones on their stock lines. However, I do know of a few so-called breeders (the unethical ones) using steroids and growth hormones on their dogs to create giagantic Rottweilers (I even know of one that used a Newfounland bitch as a base to start-up his "big" production of puppies... after 2 generations this a**h*** is being producing consistently 150 to 160 lbs "Rottweilers" look-alikes or mutts!).

You can see the OBVIOUS results from drug use: swollen-up massive bodies. These "breeders" advertise their dogs as the "biggest of all"... Dhaaaa! One wonders why? It's pitiful. The breed standards are being totally ignored, and wrongfully modified, to satisfy the American public demand for the "largest" Rottweilers... all in detriment of the breed's health and performance!

[This message has been edited by German Vanegas (edited September 02, 1999).]
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  #4  
Old 09-02-1999, 11:17 AM
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Join Date: Dec 1998
If they're on steroids they're also not likely to be producing many puppies .... I have absolutely no knowledge of anyone using steroids to bulk a dog up but considering other things I know people have done just to win, it would not surprise me at. After all, there are known cases of human body builders using steroids, so why not dogs.... or so the reasoning would go I guess. In theory, yes, I'd believe it - but as for first-hand, or even second-hand knowledge, no - I don't know of anybody who does this. I've only heard rumors - as always, unreliable at best.

Nancy

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von Dorow Rottweilers
doggo1@apex2000.net


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  #5  
Old 09-02-1999, 01:21 PM
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Join Date: Mar 1999
I have seen pics of Jeneck's Wotan both from the front and the side. I always wondered how he gets his dogs to be so rippled with muscle. They really have a body builder look! Its amazing. I have seen dogs that are on good food and are well conditioned none of them look like the way these dogs do. May be it is years of selective breeding that causes this effect! I do not believe that a reputable breeder like Eckhart would put his dogs on anabolic steriods...it only causes lowered sperm count! Now...why would anybody want to do that to their dogs?

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With warm and furry regards from Ashu, Mika, Bruno and Dominic.
"Don't eat animals love them!!"

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  #6  
Old 09-02-1999, 09:55 PM
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Join Date: Jul 1999
I have seen a few of the Jeneks dogs at the National show in Chicago in 97... and they didnt have the appearance of steriod useage... if this look is anything like it is in humans... they would have alot of water retention and have a puffy look.. not so toned in appearance... steriods are for mass... people use them to bulk up then they tone from there....or so I have heard...
I think he just has dogs with big bone... with an especially large fore-frame.... meaning big shoulders... chest... neck and heads.... and as others previously stated... if this wasnt genetic.. then it wouldnt be consistent in this line of dogs... and he is producing the same qualities that he has in his own dogs... and I can vouch for that... my close friend has a Wotan son.....and he too has these same qualities..... head.. shoulders... etc.
I am sure there are others out there that have stooped to this level... anything is possible... I feel that if you can think of it...then someone out there is probably doing it somewhere... Just my opinion though....
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  #7  
Old 09-02-1999, 10:39 PM
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Join Date: Nov 1998
In my opinion Jeneck's Rottweilers are one the finest lines in the USA, with International recognition. The Jeneck's are unquestionably committed and devoted to the betterment of the breed, so I wouldn't think for a moment that Jeneck's dogs are "steroid-freaks", but they are the result of pure hard work from well-thought breeding programs, with the preservation of the true working Rottweiler in mind.

Now, the so-called "breeders" I mentioned are obviously not only unethical but profit motivated. Bear in mind that blowing-up those dogs with anabolic steroids, thus increasing their size, has the purpose to impress people looking for huge Rottweilers... so when people come to see the litter and the parents, the "breeders" proudly display his/er gigantic dog... and most people go: "WOW! I want a puppy from this dog"... although the off-spring will not benefit from the steroids used on the sire... so the buyer will later be greatly disappointed when his/er dog doesn't grow to be like "daddy"... Tricks of the dishonest and shameful driven by an ignorant demand for XXL dogs...
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  #8  
Old 09-03-1999, 05:46 PM
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Join Date: Jun 1999
Taboo,
This subject is taboo unless someone has serious proof!I personally own two Moritz son's and i can attest they are drug free!One of my dogs is thick very powerful and well defined he runs 7 days a week and swims whenever he can!I know Salquist's lines and will tell you straight out they are very well conditioned he runs his dogs it shows in the ring.These dogs like Orville stated produce very heavy bone tremendous forechest and muscle.I'm sure in some very isolated cases this is true because of the money involved? So two things if you like thick powerful rotts buy these lines and get your couch slouch out and exercize him!!

------------------
Ct.Tom

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  #9  
Old 09-03-1999, 09:46 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 1998
It is quite obvious that true reputable ethical breeders do not mess-up their dogs lines by using anabolic steroids, simply because these real breeders do love the breed and commit to the preservation of the working Rottweiler, as it is established and desired by official recognized entities (ADRK, FCI, etc).

However, there are sleaze bags, that call themselves "breeders", that balloon-up their dogs with anabolic drugs, just to increase their size with the express purpose of selling their commercially produced litters advertised as coming from HUGE GIANT Rottweilers.

The bottom line is, as long as you deal with ethical breeders from known-traceable-verifiable pedigrees, of course you are fine... but don't think for a second that everybody is that ethical and honest. There are a few idiots that use steroids to make bigger dogs to satisfy the demand for the largest Rottweilers... as most prospective Rottweiler owners have in mind. You know, the kind that inquiries the breeder: "I want a big Rottie pup. How much does the "dad" weighs???"... Be careful, you may get what you wish for...


[This message has been edited by German Vanegas (edited September 04, 1999).]
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  #10  
Old 09-04-1999, 03:44 PM
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Join Date: Jun 1999
German,
Please understand my post it says people get mixed up about steroids.You need to understand one thing I DO NOT CONDONE THIS AT ALL!What i was explaining was why one might(use them for monetary gain) and you are absolutely wrong about steroids there are different types!They all do basically the same thing but not all cause,bloat and water retention although most do.Yes anabolic steroids create muscle mass and size but again not all of them work the same way!I honestly do not want to discuss steroids just why someone would use them!

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Ct.Tom

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  #11  
Old 09-04-1999, 04:48 PM
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Join Date: Mar 1999
I have also heard that some people give food to their dogs with very high protain levels eg Royal Canine 36% protain and they add even more protain to it.

This also builds up muscle if the dog is exercised, but it is very bad for the dogs health if you give so mutch protain. It shows later on. I think it causes severe problems in the kidneys of the dog.

This is what I heard from some vets.
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  #12  
Old 09-04-1999, 08:37 PM
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Join Date: Oct 1998
The protien source has more to do with how harmful it will be than the precentage. If the protien is of a gain source then the dog's organs become stressed proccessing the protien. But if the potien comes from meat then there is no ill effects reguardless of the precentage. Most commercial dog food are a combination of both. The quality will many times reflect the amount of meat vs grains as the protien source. If you were to take one cup of a high grade commercial food and then add one cup of raw beef, you would increase the protien percentage greatly with no ill effects.
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  #13  
Old 09-04-1999, 10:08 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 1998
To breakdown animal protein into amino acids, so the disgestive system absorbs the best of the protein source, the liver is overloaded with work and so are the kidneys in eliminating excesses. Too much animal protein, whatever the quality may be, stresses out the dog's digestive system. Besides, such excesses of protein will be found on the dog's stool... meaning: it is being literally wasted!
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  #14  
Old 09-05-1999, 12:31 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
German,
I think the use of steroids is for enhancing the muscle mass not just to make the dog bigger.There are all different types of steroids people get confused with that.Weight of the dog could actually go down and body fat dropped this would make for a dog that looks bigger but is actually just more defined!I think this is what there out for to make the dog look more musclular.The Eastern Block nations are very well advanced in this method they especially no how to hide there use!Just look at the olympics?I don't think the top breeders are using drugs to enhance the dogs appearance. I think they have very well built lines through research and breeding programs jealousy runs rampant with success!With the use of steroids it would also make for a very unpredictable dog!Super agressive,with shrunken testicles in most cases!This would also seriously affect semen production.With 40 breedings a yr at say 1000 .00 at maybe 6 solid years to breed your talking 240,000.00 hummm..lot of cash folks this is the motivation!!If your dog was very close to being one of the say Rick's of the world it would be tempting??That and with the knowledge on how to properly use them you could produce a super dog!!I think the question is valid just not very ethical?

------------------
Ct.Tom

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  #15  
Old 09-05-1999, 12:48 AM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 1998
Ct Tom,
Anabolic steroids do increase muscular mass and size, making a human (or a dog for this matter) bigger. Fat tissue is decrease throughout proper nutrition and intense aerobic activity, which "muscle heads" do to attain the desired lean definition. In most sports anabolic steroids are used to increase mass, size, strength, and the "killer instinct" (aggression is "on the side"). There are plenty of documented scientific evidence that clearly demonstrates that anabolic drugs have more serious side effects that far outweighs any narcissistic benefits ("I'm the biggest and the baddest").

So if there are imbeciles that use steroids for themselves, why it would surprise you so much that they would use in dogs, when it has been used on horses and bulls before?... Again, not everybody has common sense, honesty, and decency... when it comes to money some people stop at nothing. Of course, I am not discrediting ethical breeders and their lines at all. I have been close enough myself to see the devotion and commitment of the real breeders, who maintain the higher standards of the breed without using anything artificial. I can attest for plenty of unquestionable ethical breeders... but once again, not everybody is like that, and you know it!
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