When to neuter??

[spidey]

My intact dog does not hump because I have trained him not to (all part of teaching a dog to live well with humans, in my opinion). My friend's dog (neutered at 6 months) humps everything in sight because he has NOT been trained not to.

Neutering is not a reliable way to solve ingrained behavioural problems, training is. Not that I am advocating NOT neutering, but it worries me when people want to neuter dogs to solve behavioural problems, rather than addressing those problems through training.

[wagondog]

Hello Spidey,
Can you answer my question, why some males and females mount and some don't? I too have trained dogs not to mount, but my recent dog just showed no interest in doing it at all. Tell me why, cause I don't know.
Jerry

[Judi W]

To a large degree I see this behavior with dogs who belong to permissive owners who seem to find infantile behavior something cute, or interesting, or charming and are hesitant to teach limits. At about 4 months of age, within the dog world, youngsters are expected to abide by good doggy manners and rude pups are quickly corrected. Those that are not taught that by their peers should be taught by their owners. Owners who do not do so do their dogs a disservice making them unlikable by people and other dogs alike.

[Jimdeez]

Wagon did your dog develop properly after u neutered him at 10 mos? I searched neuter and there was another thread on this topic and it was said that the heads dont develop too what they would if they werent neutered?

[wagondog]

Jimdeez,
Jake has become the most majestic dog I have owned, just my biased opinion of course. As for the size of his head, let's say you could serve a small lunch on it
If I ever become a member I'll post a photo of Jake the Wagon Dog at work.
Jerry

[Maryn306]

Originally Posted by Judi W

To a large degree I see this behavior with dogs who belong to permissive owners who seem to find infantile behavior something cute, or interesting, or charming and are hesitant to teach limits.

I think you're onto something here :)

Rocco came to me from foster care. He was allowed on the couch, they didn't discourage humping because 'he was just neutered, he needs time to grow out of it', he was allowed to mouth because it didn't hurt, and it was 'cute' when he'd beg for or steal food. He was just a cute puppy who was allowed to do what he wanted because it was cute/funny. They said they tried to tell him no on some things...but he was too young to listen.

They meant well, and were very nice people, but I don't think they should have been fostering a rott. My friend runs the rescue, and I shared my concerns with her.

He was most certainly not too young to listen, no one was firm with him, and he saw no reason to listen. He listens perfectly well now, and is smart enough to read your face to KNOW when something is not acceptable. I knocked the humping out RIGHT off the bat. The way I see it, if he can hump someone..he gets the idea that he is dominant over them, and that will not fly. Mouthing, BIG NO. I started on that right away as well, and we are still working on it. He is still a pup, and does get the urge at times, but he is always corrected and stops. The couch thing...I let him go on for a few days, because I didn't want everything to change on him so soon..I was being soft. I asked advice here, and wised up...ALL furniture is now off limits (he was used to being on the BED too), he KNOWS what 'OFF' means.
Begging for/stealing food...he hasn't even attempted yet. He DID snag a chocolate rabbit in plastic off the counter yesterday, but I caught him before he could eat any, and he is being taught that the countertops are OFF limits as well.

I lack some sense at times, and make mistakes like everyone else..but I refuse to be a passive owner.

And now that I've rambled..I'll simply state that I believe Judi is correct, and with reason.

[wagondog]

I'm a new member and I have found that JudiW is always correct, she gets my attention with every post.

[spidey]

Judi is as always correct.

I'll add the obvious that mounting and humping can be dominance and/or play behaviours.

[Judi W]

Originally Posted by spidey

Judi is as always correct.

I'll add the obvious that mounting and humping can be dominance and/or play behaviours.

oh oh oh, I just loved that! You are correct that it can be dominance or play but it is always rude and only continues beyond infancy when passively encouraged or sometimes less than bright owners even laugh at it.

My favorite thing to say to them (and not really joking BTW) is that if the dog is too stupid to know the difference between a pillow, a person's leg, a fence post, or any dog that is not a bitch in season - it is too dumb to be allowed to reproduce itself anyway.

[bolt94]

Originally Posted by Judi W

it can be dominance or play but it is always rude and only continues beyond infancy when passively encouraged or sometimes less than bright owners even laugh at it.

It's no laughing matter for me. I find it quite embarassing, actually.

I just wasn't sure if it was "normal" because that's "just what dogs do."

[spidey]

Originally Posted by Judi W

oh oh oh, I just loved that! You are correct that it can be dominance or play but it is always rude and only continues beyond infancy when passively encouraged or sometimes less than bright owners even laugh at it.

Oh definitely, didn't mean to imply otherwise!

bolt94, it's both "normal" and "just what dogs do", but that doesn't mean they can't learn not to do it, or that it should be allowed. As I mentioned earlier, we have to teach dogs to live well with us, and this is one part of that. And since most of our dogs don't have the opportunity to learn thorough "dog manners", it's a good idea to discourage mounting other dogs, not least because some dogs take great offense at it and will nail a dog who tries it. Dogs absolutely can learn self control in this respect. My dog needed one verbal correction and one verbal reminder and he hasn't done it since (he is very handler-soft), but I made it clear that it wasn't acceptable the first time he did it so it never became an ingrained behaviour for him. A dog who's been allowed to do it might require a bit more training to discourage the behaviour, but if you've built a good working relationship with your dog it shouldn't take too much effort.

[SigTau66]

To get back to the question at hand about what age to neuter, this thread:

http://www.rottweiler.net/forums/sho...ghlight=neuter

has a link in it about a study investigating the link between certain types of bone cancer in our breed and the age at which they were neutered.

Reading the study has convinced me to not get my boy neutered until at least 18 months old. But of course, every person's situation is different and there may be overwhelming reasons to get your dog neutered earlier. But I think it's always best to have as much knowledge as you can before making that decision.

[Judi W]

I would suggest that if your dog has access to any intact bitches, one or the other needs desexing promptly.

[bolt94]

Originally Posted by spidey

bolt94, it's both "normal" and "just what dogs do", but that doesn't mean they can't learn not to do it, or that it should be allowed. As I mentioned earlier, we have to teach dogs to live well with us, and this is one part of that. And since most of our dogs don't have the opportunity to learn thorough "dog manners", it's a good idea to discourage mounting other dogs, not least because some dogs take great offense at it and will nail a dog who tries it. Dogs absolutely can learn self control in this respect. My dog needed one verbal correction and one verbal reminder and he hasn't done it since (he is very handler-soft), but I made it clear that it wasn't acceptable the first time he did it so it never became an ingrained behaviour for him. A dog who's been allowed to do it might require a bit more training to discourage the behaviour, but if you've built a good working relationship with your dog it shouldn't take too much effort.

Since Hunter was a rescue, I have NO idea what he was allowed to do BEFORE we got him. At over a year old, he wasn't even house trained. Thankfully, that only took about two days. As for the humping, I've since put a stop to it. Funny thing is, he only does it to dogs HIS size. A friend has a male Pug and the two are the best of friends (no humping).

I see that I have LOTS to learn from this dog and can only hope that I become a better owner/handler/mom over time. He's really come a long way since October 31st. It can only get better. :)