New Rottie Owner with 10 week old rottie male - general advice

[eva247]

Hi everyone,
I have had my rottie male puppy for 3 weeks now - he (Kane) is now 10 weeks old.
He has been an absolute pleasure to have however, I was hoping you experienced guys could give me some knowledgeable and interesting advice to make sure that I am doing the right thing from the start!
Kane is not allowed upstairs or on the sofa, I feed him in his crate (to make sure he sees it as a positive place to be), he pees on his newspaper area either in the crate or at the far end of the kitchen (apart from the occasional pee or no.2 on the carpet!), I work but as I am in field sales I always ensure that I come home every 3 hours or so to play, give him a run around in the garden or feed him as necessary, he sits when I tell him to, he comes to me when I call his name and so far, Kane seems to be quite a submissive character however, I do have a few things I would like some advice on.
(a) I have been socialising him as he is not fully vaccinated by trips in the car to the supermarket, school, train station, etc and stand outside with him in my arms so he can see different people, sounds, etc. Kane seems fine around other animals but humans is a different issue - when I have him in my arms so many people come to me wanting to stroke him (as he is a right little cutie!) but he always growls and attempts to bite them unless I hold their hand first! basically, I am finding that anyone who approaches him that he doesn't know, I have to hold their hand and stroke it and then Kane will sniff them and lick their hand otherwise he will growl and bite them (the same with my 8 year old daughters friends - she has to do the same). Is this Kane being protective towards me and my little girl? and am I doing the right thing by responding in this manner?
(b) As I said above he is fine around other animals apart from ones who bark at him - I picked my daughter up from the childminder a couple of days ago and brought him with me, my childminder has a yorkie who is about 6/7 years old and when I came in she was barking aggressively. Kane was in my arms and normally he is fine but he started trying to push his way out of my arms and was growling badly at the other dog. It was like he was telling her you watch it if I get down and get a hold of you!! Is this normal reactive behaviour?
(c) Mouthing (as in biting) - Kane has a tendency to go the extra mile on this one!!! He does stop when he knows that I have totally had enough and me and my daughter ignore him but he trys to go as far as he can on this one :p As any other puppy he gets overexcited whilst playing and tries to bite my hand, tops/backs of our foot and more lately my breast :D . Although this is quite funny in reading it, it is becoming a real pain! I have a trainer and he advised a plastic bottle with coins to shake when he bites. This does work in deterring him from doing the action but I put something else in his mouth and he comes back for more - sometimes the shaking of the bottle, shouting 'no', yelping, etc.. seems to hype him up and he gets worse until I totally lose it (not control) but just walk off in such a hump that he comes to me, sits in front of me and puts his head down on the ground and looks up at me like to say 'I'm sorry mummy' so I give him a stroke and then he goes on his tangent again!
Even when playing, I will have one side of his toy in my hand whilst the other is in his mouth and he slyly starts biting it towards my hand until he can go for my hand completely. I know that this is all normal puppy behaviour and I have been told by others to shake him by the neck (like his mum would do) or push him to the side but I do not believe that man-handling an animal is the right way as then, am I not showing that to get the outcome you want that it is ok to be aggressive?
Anyway, I won't go on anymore than I have and I look forward to any advice to the above or any general suggestions!
Thanks, Eva, Kianna (my 8 year old daughter) and Kane (10 week old rottie male)

[Blair]

I am sure some one with a lot more knowledge will help you out but the growling nad biting just doesnt seem right to me. When my boy was 10 weeks old he greeted people with a wag of his butt and licks, he has never growled at anyone or snapped and he is 4 months now. Hard for me to hear of a 10wk puppy growling and biting people, just doesnt seem right to me. Congrats on the new puppy!!!!

[maguirre]

Doesn´t seem right to me either, the growling nad biting I mean. I too am a first time rottie owner. Mara is 8 w/o. She is a pleasure and she is also obedient and aims to please all the time. But, same as blair´s boy, greets people with a waggy tail and licks. When we go to the park or when people come visit, she´ll run to greet them and try to play with everyone.

As for advice, read! I have found thousands of post in this site that have really helped me become a better owner. Also there are some books recommended in this site that are very useful. I bought Rottweilers for dummies, recommended by experienced people here and it is great.

Congrats on your new baby! :)

[HerculesMomma]

I can't help much since I'm a new rottie owner too, but I got mine as an adult from the shelter. I can tell you I just finished reading the book by Patricia McConnell called The other end of the Leah and I found it extremely helpful. One of the things she mentioned in her book is that often yelling at a dog makes him look at you like you have no authority over him (I believe her refernce was to wolf pups who are very loud and high pitched). She recommened giving your dog commands in a low, calm voice because the louder, higher pitched voice can actually get a dog excited or hyper or something along those lines.

I'm sure some people with more expierence will be along shortly to help though, so hang in there. Welcome to the group! :)

[eva247]

Thanks for the responses so far - sorry if I was misunderstood but he doesn't actually go out of his way to bite people, this only tends to happen when people swoop down on him. The trainer I have did say that he seems to be very submissive (he tends to go in between my legs when he is on the ground and someone approaches him & if a stranger holds him he just stays as still as a statue and starts shaking like if he were cold) however, that this can also be a problem as he could just be a frightened little pup. The growling and biting part only seems to happen when I am holding him or my partner is, if I go to a friends house and put him on the floor then he just sniffs his way around to the person, they may get a little growl if they approach him hastily but he does not seem to be aggressive. Hence why I ask if this is him being protective? It might seem a strange thing to say but he is more growly towards certain people, I am white, my daughter is mixed race and my partner is black - Kane seems okay towards asian and black males but not white males, white females but not black females ??? Kids in general he seems fine with apart from the odd puppy hyper-activity when he starts mouthing their shoes and trousers.
Bottom line is at this moment in his life he only seems to appreciate cuddles and comfort from me, my daughter and my partner.

[excellrott]

Seems to me, after reading the Security thread, that some of this behavior is normal for a "real' Rott. As I understand it, they should not be wiggle-butt for everyone they meet. Sounds like you've got your hands full, Congratualtions!!!

[Roxibear]

My pup Roxi is six months tomorrow and she was quite mouthy with my 8 year old son for the first couple of weeks. I did correct her but I think it was just a puppy thing. I would be more concerned about the growling. With Roxi any nips came from over excited playing but there was no growling. I had a freind who got a rottie pup years ago who was hand shy, eventually he had to be put down at just over 2 years. It turned out the pup was being slapped at a very early age for peeing. There might be an underlying reason as to why he is growling at certain people. I don't think he would know what being protective is at such an early age. Anyway good luck and there are a good few experts on here who will give you excellent explanations on behaviour.

[Blair]

Originally Posted by excellrott

Seems to me, after reading the Security thread, that some of this behavior is normal for a "real' Rott. As I understand it, they should not be wiggle-butt for everyone they meet. Sounds like you've got your hands full, Congratualtions!!!

I guess Zeus isnt a "real" rottie :( because everyone he meets he wiggle his butt out of excitment! Now I need to break the news to Zeus that he isnt real LOL

[excellrott]

Poor Zeus :( I hope his momma loves him anyway ;)

[poohbearsmom]

Originally Posted by eva247

Hi everyone,
I have had my rottie male puppy for 3 weeks now - he (Kane) is now 10 weeks old.
He has been an absolute pleasure to have however, I was hoping you experienced guys could give me some knowledgeable and interesting advice to make sure that I am doing the right thing from the start!
Kane is not allowed upstairs or on the sofa, I feed him in his crate (to make sure he sees it as a positive place to be), he pees on his newspaper area either in the crate or at the far end of the kitchen (apart from the occasional pee or no.2 on the carpet!), I work but as I am in field sales I always ensure that I come home every 3 hours or so to play, give him a run around in the garden or feed him as necessary, he sits when I tell him to, he comes to me when I call his name and so far, Kane seems to be quite a submissive character however, I do have a few things I would like some advice on.
(a) I have been socialising him as he is not fully vaccinated by trips in the car to the supermarket, school, train station, etc and stand outside with him in my arms so he can see different people, sounds, etc. Kane seems fine around other animals but humans is a different issue - when I have him in my arms so many people come to me wanting to stroke him (as he is a right little cutie!) but he always growls and attempts to bite them unless I hold their hand first! basically, I am finding that anyone who approaches him that he doesn't know, I have to hold their hand and stroke it and then Kane will sniff them and lick their hand otherwise he will growl and bite them (the same with my 8 year old daughters friends - she has to do the same). Is this Kane being protective towards me and my little girl? and am I doing the right thing by responding in this manner?
(b) As I said above he is fine around other animals apart from ones who bark at him - I picked my daughter up from the childminder a couple of days ago and brought him with me, my childminder has a yorkie who is about 6/7 years old and when I came in she was barking aggressively. Kane was in my arms and normally he is fine but he started trying to push his way out of my arms and was growling badly at the other dog. It was like he was telling her you watch it if I get down and get a hold of you!! Is this normal reactive behaviour?
(c) Mouthing (as in biting) - Kane has a tendency to go the extra mile on this one!!! He does stop when he knows that I have totally had enough and me and my daughter ignore him but he trys to go as far as he can on this one :p As any other puppy he gets overexcited whilst playing and tries to bite my hand, tops/backs of our foot and more lately my breast :D . Although this is quite funny in reading it, it is becoming a real pain! I have a trainer and he advised a plastic bottle with coins to shake when he bites. This does work in deterring him from doing the action but I put something else in his mouth and he comes back for more - sometimes the shaking of the bottle, shouting 'no', yelping, etc.. seems to hype him up and he gets worse until I totally lose it (not control) but just walk off in such a hump that he comes to me, sits in front of me and puts his head down on the ground and looks up at me like to say 'I'm sorry mummy' so I give him a stroke and then he goes on his tangent again!
Even when playing, I will have one side of his toy in my hand whilst the other is in his mouth and he slyly starts biting it towards my hand until he can go for my hand completely. I know that this is all normal puppy behaviour and I have been told by others to shake him by the neck (like his mum would do) or push him to the side but I do not believe that man-handling an animal is the right way as then, am I not showing that to get the outcome you want that it is ok to be aggressive?
Anyway, I won't go on anymore than I have and I look forward to any advice to the above or any general suggestions!
Thanks, Eva, Kianna (my 8 year old daughter) and Kane (10 week old rottie male)

Welcome, Eva...

Sounds like you have a fairly normal rottie pup on your hands, and from the sounds of your post, you have a couple of issues to deal with.

Barking at strangers. This is a fear response at this age. The pup is essentially using his bark to scare the offender away, in hopes of saving his own hide.
When a pup or young dog (he could very well be on the tail end of a fear period) behaves in a fearful manner (i.e. barking, hackles up, backing away from the offending object/person), it's very handy to keep some tasty treats in your pocket.
Talk to the offending object (doesn't matter if it's a chair out of place, a child on a bike, or whatever) in a happy voice, and approach the offender with confidence... When the pup starts to recover from it's scared behavior, praise praise praise.. Tell the pup how brave he is...
Touch the offending object (shake hands, stroke the chair), and keep up your happy demeanor... essentially, what you're doing is showing the pup there is nothing to fear here. PRAISE PRAISE PRAISE as you see the pup relax and explore what previously scared him.
Never force the pup or push the pup... he needs to figure it out "on his own" (along with your guidance).
Exercises like the one above increase the pup's confidence levels.

Biting/Mouthing.
There are a LOT of threads on the forums here pertaining to this issue.
Please do a search on the subject, you should have a good day's reading there. LOL.
For one.... At this age, you can use a favorite toy to guide the pup's attention from your leg to the toy... then praise when the pup has his mouth on an appropriate chew toy.

At 10weeks, your pup is capable of being house trained. I'd personally throw away the newspapers (you don't want to cement the idea that it's OK to go in the house), especially since you're home every three hours or so - he should be able to hold it all night by this age as well. Give your pup a chance to do things right. Be consistant. By feeding the pup 3 meals per day at the same time, you can pretty much set your clock on his bowel movement/urination schedule. ;)

Sounds like you're doing good with your boy.... hope these pointers help you some. Keep SOCIALIZING SOCIALIZING SOCIALIZING. Do it at your pup's speed, and guide him through stress... just as you would a small child... A dog needs to know that "what does not kill you, only makes you stronger." !!

Good luck!

[eva247]

Poohbearsmum - That was great help!!! and yes, you are right about the house training however, he just refuses to pee outside but I know with a bit of patience this should be rectified quickly.
You are also more than likely right about the fear stage as even just a moment ago Kane heard a noise outside and he barked went to the door and then flew back in between my legs. Whatever I'm doing in the house, Kanes there either laying in between my legs or on top of my feet!
Quick question for you - my boyfriend only comes up at weekends and Kane is absolutely besotted with him (piddles everytime he gets here and he strokes him) but when it comes to playing with each other - its like having 2 bloody dogs - the games never get out of hand but they both just tug of war and continuosly growl at each other. I've told my boyfriend not to do this as something tells me that problems could arise but he thinks I'm being silly

[Roxibear]

Originally Posted by eva247

Poohbearsmum - That was great help!!! and yes, you are right about the house training however, he just refuses to pee outside but I know with a bit of patience this should be rectified quickly.
You are also more than likely right about the fear stage as even just a moment ago Kane heard a noise outside and he barked went to the door and then flew back in between my legs. Whatever I'm doing in the house, Kanes there either laying in between my legs or on top of my feet!
Quick question for you - my boyfriend only comes up at weekends and Kane is absolutely besotted with him (piddles everytime he gets here and he strokes him) but when it comes to playing with each other - its like having 2 bloody dogs - the games never get out of hand but they both just tug of war and continuosly growl at each other. I've told my boyfriend not to do this as something tells me that problems could arise but he thinks I'm being silly

You are right to tell him not to do this, especially with a pup that thinks growling is ok. Sometimes its easier to train the dogs than it is to train the people.

[K9-man]

Originally Posted by eva247

Mouthing (as in biting) - Kane has a tendency to go the extra mile on this one!!! He does stop when he knows that I have totally had enough and me and my daughter ignore him but he trys to go as far as he can on this one :p As any other puppy he gets overexcited whilst playing and tries to bite my hand, tops/backs of our foot and more lately my breast :D . Although this is quite funny in reading it, it is becoming a real pain! I have a trainer and he advised a plastic bottle with coins to shake when he bites. This does work in deterring him from doing the action but I put something else in his mouth and he comes back for more - sometimes the shaking of the bottle, shouting 'no', yelping, etc.. seems to hype him up and he gets worse until I totally lose it (not control) but just walk off in such a hump that he comes to me, sits in front of me and puts his head down on the ground and looks up at me like to say 'I'm sorry mummy' so I give him a stroke and then he goes on his tangent again!

“but just walk off in such a hump that he comes to me, sits in front of me and puts his head down on the ground and looks up at me like to say 'I'm sorry mummy' so I give him a stroke and then he goes on his tangent again!”

This is one of the best methods to use except you’re making one mistake. Instead of petting him after he gives you that sympathetic look, continue to ignore him.

When puppies are playing and one gets too rough with another, the pup on the receiving end of the over zealous pup will yelp, scurry away from the litter and sit down. Hence, puppies learn that if they bite their playmate too hard, their playmate stops playing with them.

Next time you’re playing with Kane and he gets to pushy with the teeth, abruptly get up (yelping is optional) and leave the room closing the door somewhat forcibly. Stay out for at least 2 minutes – be sure the room is puppy-proofed, by the way.

Then go back in the room and totally ignore him for at least 20 minutes. A high-ranking pack member enforces her status by ignoring underlings!

After that, if you choose to interact with him some more and he gets too mouthy again – do the exact same thing.

He should catch on real quickly that if he gets too rough with his playmates, his playmates won’t play with him.

[Luvs]

Originally Posted by eva247

Hi everyone,
I have had my rottie male puppy for 3 weeks now - he (Kane) is now 10 weeks old.
Kane is not allowed upstairs or on the sofa, I feed him in his crate (to make sure he sees it as a positive place to be), he pees on his newspaper area either in the crate or at the far end of the kitchen (apart from the occasional pee or no.2 on the carpet!)

I personally wouldn't put newspaper in the crate for him to pee on. Your puppy will learn not to pee where he sleeps, but putting newspaper in there for him to piddle on will prevent this from happening. You are teaching him that it is ok to go potty in his crate. I don't let my puppies go to the bathroom in my house from the first day they are brought home. Of course ALL puppies have accidents but I don't encourage them to go inside by putting newspaper down, I feel this just makes potty training take that much longer.

Originally Posted by eva247

(a) I have been socialising him as he is not fully vaccinated by trips in the car to the supermarket, school, train station, etc and stand outside with him in my arms so he can see different people, sounds, etc. Kane seems fine around other animals but humans is a different issue - when I have him in my arms so many people come to me wanting to stroke him (as he is a right little cutie!) but he always growls and attempts to bite them unless I hold their hand first! basically, I am finding that anyone who approaches him that he doesn't know, I have to hold their hand and stroke it and then Kane will sniff them and lick their hand otherwise he will growl and bite them (the same with my 8 year old daughters friends - she has to do the same). Is this Kane being protective towards me and my little girl? and am I doing the right thing by responding in this manner?

He may do better if you let him approach people instead of letting them approach him. Let him approach on his own without you forcing him. Most puppies will let curiousity overtake them and eventually go up to people. It just takes some a little longer than others ;) One thing to remember is be sure not to coddle him when he is afraid of something or someone. If you coddle him when he is afraid you are telling him that he has a reason to be afraid. Instead, talk in a very happy voice to the person or object that he is afraid of and ignore the fact that he is afraid of it.

Good luck with your new boy! It sounds like you are off to a good start. Be sure and post pictures when you have gained full member status. :D

[eva247]

Thanks alot guys - all makes sense and I know it is all about having the patience!
Kane is quite a stubborn, serious little one but seems to have more respect when I am calm on telling him off.
K9-Man - I take it on board so will just ignore him longer ;)
Luvs - I see your point, I did what the breeder suggested I do but I think you're definitely right as it seems almost impossible to now make him understand not to pee on the newspapers but outside in the garden. I must have confused Kane, one minute its okay to pee in the house in specific areas and then its not and it has to be outside :( poor little mite must be thinking 'is this woman mad!' :D