Security or insecurity? You pick one!

[German Vanegas]

Originally Posted by eva247

... On occasions when you are an expert and know so much - you need to relay that constructively and in small quantities so people such as myself can digest the information rather then crap themselves and shy away from it!!!

I am sharing with everybody what the history and tradition of the rottweiler breed truly is, while, at the same time, promoting ethical breeding and responsible dog ownership. Some people will feel capable to debate the issue, others just read and make their own conclusions, hopefully with addittional research. There is only so much I can do ;)

[Patty1231]

As a parent and a first-time rottie owner, I say you SHOULD be scared. If you're not, you're not going to pay attention to the advice and seek as much knowledge as you can. Raising a dog can be quite similar to raising a child. It's not for someone who wants a "baby/puppy" but for someone who can look to the future of what that baby/puppy will become. Seek knowledge, listen to the advice of those who came before, and teach/train. Getting it wrong because we have our own preconceived notions of how it should be could be disastrous. My son is now 20 and turned out to be a pretty great individual - because I listened to my heart AND to those with experience. I hope the same can be said of my rotties.

[German Vanegas]

Originally Posted by TrinityRun

...We all were new once. I chose not to "crap on myself" and read, read, reread and reread some more until I had it ingrained in my head. I asked questions and listened to the answers. If I didn't understand something, I probed further until I did but I never let anything that was over my head deter me from understanding it. I knew if I kept at it, I would come to understand full circle and this was before the Internet that so many newbies have available at their fingertips today. It made getting an education much more difficult and it also forced me to get out there and seek it instead of sitting back and just soaking it in.

Maybe there's a lesson in that?

And that's what is all about. I was not born a knowledgeable person about anything either. Lucky me I grew up around the Doberman pinscher breed with a great experienced tutor: my grandfather. His influence motivated me to further my education in the subject of canines, and I became heavily involved in obedience, protection & guard dog training. So here I am sharing my personal education and experience with everybody, for whatever that is worth. Those of open mind will learn from it, others choose to make a mockery out of my views, but I know I am no buffoon ;) :)

Note: In the mid 80's I switched to the rottweiler breed to the dismay of the tradition of my family... My dad and mom still are Dobbie lovers.

[German Vanegas]

Originally Posted by Patty1231

As a parent and a first-time rottie owner, I say you SHOULD be scared. If you're not, you're not going to pay attention to the advice and seek as much knowledge as you can. Raising a dog can be quite similar to raising a child. It's not for someone who wants a "baby/puppy" but for someone who can look to the future of what that baby/puppy will become. Seek knowledge, listen to the advice of those who came before, and teach/train. Getting it wrong because we have our own preconceived notions of how it should be could be disastrous. My son is now 20 and turned out to be a pretty great individual - because I listened to my heart AND to those with experience. I hope the same can be said of my rotties.

WOW! I don't know what else to say... I guess that says it all! :)

[Mattweiser]

I am thinking that this thread might have run its course.. but I will chime in anyway:

Standing for inspection, if a product of training, should not in anyway diminish the dog's ability to protect. It is all a matter of how it is trained to "stand"...

Sure a "Koehler" style of training would cause the dog to limit its guarding instinct....

But a more "mental" type of training should not in anyway, cause the dog to lose its protective ability.

[Joette]

Originally Posted by German Vanegas

WOW! I don't know what else to say... I guess that says it all! :)

German: IMO I think you are doing a great job. ;) ;) I hope you have more to say and add. :)

As a new rottie owner, I have followed this thread with great interest. Not only has it been extremely informative, but very thought provoking as well. While this may be off topic, and if so, I do apologize, but I do feel compelled to at least voice my opinon.

Patty, I agree, IT IS SCARY if you take the responsiblity of either parenting, or animal ownership seriously. Before adding a rottie to my house, I researched the breed at length with regard to behavior, size, expense, tradition and classification of the breed, obedience training needs, potential health problems, etc., etc., as I wanted to know what kind of a project I would be undertaking before the fact. I read the posts on this forum on a daily basis to learn as much as I can, to try to give my pup the best home I can, to recognize and avoid potential problems with him so that he and I can hopefully have a long, happy well-adjusted life together. (I also simply enjoy the banter back and forth as well :p ;) )

Titan starts OB/puppy classes in 3 weeks (after his next vacs) and I fully expect that even though he is very smart and is learning very quickly, the obedience classes will more than likely be a 2 year commitment, if not more. It was partially the need for that type of a commitment that helped me with my decision. Frankly, I am looking forward to each new thing he learns and the positive things I have been able to teach him so far.

I've said many times over the past 4 weeks, he's like having a 2 year old around the house, I have to watch him constantly and since my kids are 22 and 18, one on his own and 1 about to graduate and go off to college, I am looking forward to the project and the challenge he presents.

BUT.......now I find myself second guessing my decision based on the many posts in this thread. Am I doing him an injustice by only intending to have a pet/companion dog and doing only the OB training. Will he become an unhappy, stressed, frustrated and destructive pet? Are his mental needs perhaps greater than the OB training I can provide?

Again, I apologize if this is off topic.

[German Vanegas]

Originally Posted by Mattweiser

Sure a "Koehler" style of training would cause the dog to limit its guarding instinct...

Actually, the obsolete, and out of touch, "Koehler's guard dog training method" pushes the dog too hard in defense, making it either overly aggressive or fearfully aggressive ;) By the way Matt, do you show dogs?...

[Vista]

I can not think of a better way to bring this thread to a close than with the story of Conrad:

Originally Posted by FredAl

...I would just like to share my experience with a special Rottweiler -- an extraordinary dog named Conrad -- that would help give the breed a better reputation.

I had a male Rottweiler I acquired from Germany as a young adult with no training (I like my dogs ‘green’ so I know whatever issues manifest are totally from my own doing). I got him for SchH and protection, which he did well. He saved my life in one incident and prevented a robbery on another.

I showed him in Sieger shows and he won a few V-1 ratings. He never won a Sieger title because, back then, we were competing against excellent famous Siegers like Graf vd Teufelsbrucke, Danjo vom Schwaiger Wappen, etc. – they were really a class above my dog.

When I decided to join a K9SAR team, Conrad willingly performed the exercises and did well. He knew when to perform air-scenting/trailing for K9SAR, or tracking for SchH, when to do search and rescue for SAR, or ‘search and destroy’ for SchH.

I just wanted to take Conrad’s abilities to the fullest and I tried every activity I can enjoy with my dog. I wasn’t ready to specialize; and he wasn’t either. I taught him some tricks and used him as a breed ambassador, taking him to elementary schools and Cub Scout meetings to teach responsible pet care and bite prevention. I changed a lot of the parents’ negative perceptions about the Rottweiler breed. And the kids loved Conrad, although most of them called him Carl (the book was very popular then).

I bought a large Radio Flyer type wagon from the Amish, put a bench on it and trained Conrad on cart pulling. I trained him to respond to rein control just like a horse. We gave dog cart rides for several community events and the kids would hug him and give him treats after they enjoyed the cart ride compliments of Conrad. The kids still referred to him as Carl, though.

Since I noticed that he loved children, I also used him for therapy work to help the sick children, and also the old.

Conrad knew what to do on each activity I took him to. Well, except one. We tried herding but he bit the sheep and our test was stopped. Oh well. We can’t do ‘em all.

People complimented me on his training. But I knew that it wasn’t my training. It was Conrad. Although he had all the right canine working traits and drives and canine whatever’s, it was the way he understood and properly performed the different, often conflicting, tasks we engaged in. I can only attribute it to his sensibility. He was a thinking dog.

When he was attacked by a Cocker Spaniel while he was pulling my 9-year-old daughter on the cart, he was just quickly lifting each leg that the Spaniel was going after. As soon as I gave him permission to fight back, he merely put his mouth around the Spaniel’s neck (just pinned it down), and released when the dog submitted.

Conrad was a special Rottweiler. And I’m sure there are others out there like him. Maybe we should try breeding for sensibility too.

Originally Posted by poohbearsmom

And THAT, my friends, is a true rottweiler. CLAP CLAP CLAP.

Thanks, Fred, nice story. Good dog, Conrad.

On behalf of all of us who have and will learn from this thread, I sincerely thank you all for your contributions to this very important topic.