Luka got bit by a lab pup

[rottpup]

....Okay, we took Luka (just 6 weeks now) next door to meet the neighbor's 7 week old lab mix...they played....Luka growled...and the lab bit her (hard) on the belly...Luka screamed and screamed (and then screamed some more). She wasn't hurt but since she spends most of her day trying to be really tough (and we spend most of ours telling her she isn't) we think her ego was a little wounded. In any case, my husband picked her up to make sure she was okay and she was sooo upset, she went to sleep.
I'm assuming that this normal and okay behavior (??) I understand that littermates do that kind of stuff to each other but that little guy wasn't her brother....
I realize we are a bit obsessed with this puppy but we really want her to turn out to be a good and happy dog
Also, if anyone has any really good "no growl" advice, that would be helpful. The "no bite" thing seems to be getting through to her but ocassionally she gets REALLY pissy, growly and hard to settle if you try to take something out of her mouth

thanks for listening and trust me you'll have to do it again and again......

[ourlittlegirl]

my first dog, bear, (nonrott) was bit at about 8-10 weeks and turned out fine.. he was bit by an adult shepard that was supposed to be this highly trained police dog!?!?! whatever, seriously, if i had had a bat or gun, or anything... i'd have protected him. it just happened all so fast that i was in shock not to mention that the shepard would have killed me too. the other owner just waited a couple of seconds.. then walked away like nothing happened. Needless to say i got the dog thrown out of the appt complex! in conclusion.. take your pup to a petsmart type place, or better yet around less hostile dogs. this will ensure he understands that most dogs can be nice.

[Wrath]

Both the puppies are probably too young to have been seperated from their litter mates and thus I'm sure neither has had a chance to learn manners or how to control their bite during play. I would think all puppies play rough with each other, not just brothers and sisters, so I wouldn't worry about it too much. From your description, it sounded like a perfectly normal training session for both of the little guys. One puppy bit too hard, the other screamed, play ended. I'm sure next time their together there won't be more hard biting.

[BostonRott]

Originally posted by ourlittlegirl
my first dog, bear, (nonrott) was bit at about 8-10 weeks and turned out fine.. he was bit by an adult shepard that was supposed to be this highly trained police dog!?!?! whatever, seriously, if i had had a bat or gun, or anything... i'd have protected him. it just happened all so fast that i was in shock not to mention that the shepard would have killed me too

I don't understand this statement at all. Because a dog is a police K9, it's not supposed to bite puppies? That's a very ignorant assumption. For your information, many adult dogs do not like puppies. Corrections in the dog world are done by voice and by mouth. YOU as a puppy owner have the responsibility to ask other dog owners how their dog is with puppies, and to go on the assumption that other dogs don't like puppies and not allow your puppy in other dogs' space.

As well, most puppies should NOT be playing with adult dogs, puppies are too loose and too much injury potential abounds, especially when looking at size/weight differences between the two.

[moondog]

My dog got jumped by another puppy that was about the same age when she was just a tyke, too. They sniffed noses and then he flipped her over and went straight for her belly so fast I was shocked! Scared her and me, but no harm done. She has grown up to be a great dog.

As for the growliness when you are trying to take something out of her mouth, start teaching her to trade with you. It's a good idea to practice this with items that she is allowed to have so you can treat, praise and RETURN the toy to her and she will learn that giving up an item results in good stuff happening. Have a super yummy treat handy at all times. Use a command word ("give", "let go", or whatever word you want as long as you use it consistently) and offer the treat to her. In order to get the treat, she will need to release the item, which you then take in exchange. Praise, treat and then return the item to her. When you need to take a forbidden item out of her mouth give your command word, offer the treat and praise for the release, then redirect her to a toy that is allowed and make a big fuss over what a good girl she is. Try to really limit the number of forbidden items she has access to (keep the shoes put away!). :)

[Tim S]

OK, I'm having a bit of a problem with this whole discussion. I know I don't post as regularly as I should but I try to keep up on what's going on here.
Anyway... I am a firm believer in not letting a puppy go ANYWHERE until it's first round of shots are completed. There is too big a risk of the pup getting Parvo and many other illnesses... and ALL of you are intelligent, informed, experienced people whose lives settle around your dogs.(myself included). What is a 6-7 week old puppy doing at the neighbor's house around another (maybe healthy, maybe not) pup???!!! I really don't mean to offend anyone but GEEZE!!!

[BostonRott]

Puppies from my litters start traveling to SchH and Agility training spots at 6 weeks of age. They have their mother's immunity, and parvo is not active in the area.

I believe in socializing puppies from a young age, teaching them about car rides, and letting their own immune systems get a start on life with minor challenges.

Now, regarding puppies visiting places, it needs to be done with an understanding of maturity levels, body language and knowing when the pup is overfaced. Novices to the breed should do this ina controlled setting, with an experienced person at hand, i.e. puppy kindergarten.

[ourlittlegirl]

boston rott:
let me explain so you might understand. i was walking the pup outside to train it to go potty. a car pulled up in a carport next to mine. Their dog jumped out the car window, bit my pup, and shook it's head to try and kill him. this had nothing to do with playing! also, as far as shots go.. ask a vet and they will tell you that while too much exposure is bad, the mother's immunities are lost only at around 8 weeks of age, which btw had already been administered to bear from the humane society when i got him. hope this clears up any questions you might have about my dog caring capabilities!

[Tim S]

As I said...I meant no disrespect. I was only concerned about health risks. I've owned several adult (rescues) dogs but this is my first puppy. I simply have heard many express their opinion that the pup should not be out around other animals or in areas where other animals frequent. Nothing personal...just trying to be a responsible,caring, informed pet owner myself.
Tim

[rottpup]

A few posts ago I said that I was freaked out to put the puppy in my own backyard because I didn't want her to get sick. Eveyone said that socialization is more important than the health risks. After much reading and the use of common sense about where to bring the dog, I agreed. I thought taking her next door to meet a puppy who is healthy and had shots was a responsible start to socialization and then the puppy bit her.
I asked if the bite might make Luka afraid of other dogs, not if I am being irresponsible because I took my dog next door. I made sure to ask that question first because we are really trying to do right by litttle Luka.
Trust me, we don't want her to get sick...we love her!

[sophie's-mom]

Rottpup, please be careful.

Eveyone said that socialization is more important than the health risks.

People on THIS BOARD said that????? Are you sure?

I thought taking her next door to meet a puppy who is healthy and had shots was a responsible start to socialization

Just because that dog had his shots does not mean that dog didn't walk through something or that there is nothing in neighboring yards that might hurt your pup.

I asked if the bite might make Luka afraid of other dogs

It MIGHT make her afraid of THAT dog, but probably not......and not dogs in general.........just make sure that every experience with other dogs from here out is POSITIVE.

:)

[samanthac]

my first dog, bear, (nonrott) was bit at about 8-10 weeks and turned out fine.. he was bit by an adult shepard that was supposed to be this highly trained police dog!?!?!

I don't get this staement at all. First of all, you assume because a dog is apolice dog that it won't bite another dog? Dogs are dogs, which means they are animals. Unless you understand 'dog' and know for a fact that dog bit your pup maliciously and without provocation, then you have absolutely no base saying that. Just because a dog bites a pup does turn them into a vicous or hostile animal.

Dogs have very complex sets of rules that we don't understand because we do not speak dog. Pup probably stepped out of line in older dogs eyes, older dog taught it a lesson...i.e. taught him some manners. Since the only way dogs have to get their point across is with their mouth, it is either through a growl or a bite. Looks and sounds to us far more brutal than it is. Obviously no harm was done because the pup is still alive and well. Athena bit the crap out of Disel for some minor discretion when he was younger. It was ugly, and he cried like a baby, but he learned. Geez you should hear my dogs play. You'd think they were killing each other.

And furthermore puppies should not be playing with adult dogs because they are too free, too silly and don't know adult dog rules/manners. They violate the rules, they are going to be disciplined plain and simple. You should have exercised more caution and common sense with your own dog.

not to mention that the shepard would have killed me too.

Frankly that statement is irdiculous and quite ignorant and shows that you basically have very little grasp of canine behavior. It was one bite. Do you know for a fact that this dog would have killed you or even bit you? Did the dog ever show any aggression to you prior? Did the dog have a bite history? If it was a trained police dog, I highly doubt it. They are tested extensively for stable temperament. Just because a dog bites a pup does not throw its entire temperament into question.

You sound like an alarmist, the people who are fearful of Rottweilers and pit bulls based on sheer reputation alone. You know, the ones who say all Rottweilers are vicious killers without really knowing one. "Oh that dog looked at me. I could tell he was going to kill me." Please.

the other owner just waited a couple of seconds.. then walked away like nothing happened.!

Did it ever occur to you that perhaps he was shocked, embarrassed or plain out horrified that his dog bit your dog. Maybe he hung out for a few seconds to make sure that your dog was okay and then beat it the heck out of there because he was embarrassed and did not know what to say.

Needless to say i got the dog thrown out of the appt complex!

I am utterly appalled that you would be proud of yourself for this. I pray to God that you are never in the same position...that you lose your home or your dog because someone does not like your Rottweiler, or because your Rottweiler bit a dog or person with or without provocation. You should be absolutely ashamed of yourself not crowing like some child who just brought home an A on their report card.

in conclusion.. take your pup to a petsmart type place, or better yet around less hostile dogs. this will ensure he understands that most dogs can be nice.

In conclusion, you obviously should not be giving anyone advice on canine behvaior until you bone up on it and have a better grasp of it yourself. I suggest you find some good books on canine behavior such as Jean Donaldson's Culture Clash, and refrain from giving other behvaioral advice.

[rottpup]

Just to fill you in a little more....
I took my pup to my next door neighbors house to play with a puppy the same age. I know the neighbors and how they care for their dog. I didn't take Luka on a 6mile hike around the neighborhood and through unknown yards to meet the local dog community.
She was playing with a puppy, having fun with him, they got too wild and he nipped her on the belly. I was mainly concerned that since being socialized is a brand new thing for this little puppy, it might make her more timid around other dogs.
I'm assuming that since there will be dogs that don't like her and people that don't like her and dogs and people that do, she is going to have to get used to all of them.
As far as people saying that it is important to start socialization now...quite a few people said that waiting until she has all of her vaccinations is waiting too long to begin socializing but to of course use common sense. (read the last few responses to "update on 4 week old pup")
I'm pretty sure we did use common sense. I carried her next door to meet people that we know and trust, that also have a puppy that they want to keep healthy. She only spent about 15 minutes there (in their house) and was carried home...maybe we did something wrong...I don't know. I'm really not trying to harm my dog. There so many different opinions, I'm not sure what to believe.
When I asked my vet about taking her out and about he said "just be careful where you put her down...don't walk her in the city park" so I didn't...I put her on my neighbore carpet....

[moondog]

rottpup, I think this thread has gotten a little blown out of proportion! I can't see anything wrong with socializing your healthy puppy with another healthy puppy at the home of people you know and are aware they have the best interest of their puppy's well being at heart, just as you do for yours.

Choosing appropriate playmates is an important part of socialization, but the nip your puppy got was most likely no worse than she would have gotten from a littermate and most likely looked worse than it was. One thing you can do when these puppies are playing is keep an eye out for overly tired puppies or play that in your estimation is getting too far out of hand. If you feel it's headed for too rough or too "grumpy", change the game and involve yourself and your neighbor in the play to redirect attention on toys and off each other. Let them play with each other for a few minutes, then step in and interact with a toy for a few minutes, then let them play again for a bit, etc. Change it up and you really will be able to direct the play so everyone goes home happy!

When she was young, my dog socialized with the adult dog next door, who after very careful supervision showed that he had the tolerance of a saint and he thoroughly enjoyed using a variety of sucker plays on her while she was too young to see how she was being played! I swear he did it with a big grin on his face. :D He taught her how to play and he remains one of her favorite dogs. He's an old guy now and we still visit him regularly.

Just use common sense. Don't go to places where many dogs have been (like Petco or Petsmart or dog parks or sidewalks) and you should be fine. :)

[ourlittlegirl]

samantha..
to call me ignorant and whatever else is foolish on your part.... first of all, you were'nt there! being as YOU have no grasp on what happened your 2c don't mean much. how was this attack provoked walking into my house with the other dog in a car? dog being dog action does NOT consist of ripping the other dog's stomach and ear open! and when it ran after me?!! sure that's not malicious right?? why should i be upset about that dog getting kicked out? i can only wish it would have been you in the same situation.. imagine that dog attacking your infant!! but hey, let bygons be bygons right?? after all poor ownership of the other woman doesnt lead it to be a bad dog...