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General Info What size crate? Where to find insurance? If it doesn't quite fit in the other main forums, it goes here. We will add forums as needed.

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  #1  
Old 01-10-2003, 10:26 AM
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Mini Rottie?!?

I was at the shelter yesterday and I heard a guy talking and bragging how he was on a list for a minature rottie - get this, becasue his wife like the way they look, but was afraid of the "big ones" . I just had to inquire - it turns out that there is a group that is breeding pugs and minpins and the result is a dog that looks like a mini rott. I couldn't believe it - and thought for sure that guy was ill informed or off his rocker. When I got home hopped online at its TRUE...The dogs are being touted as mini rotties and are called Chaplin Pinchers. They are apparently being extremely careful with their breeding in hopes of establishing a new breed. The dogs are cute - but to mislead the public that the dog is a mini rottie seems wrong. Has anyone heard of such a thing or know more about this?
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  #2  
Old 01-10-2003, 10:58 AM
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I personally wish people would not try this type of thing. A Rott is a Rott and I wish they would leave it alone. That said, a Pug and a Pinscher does not make a Rott. How can they call it a mini Rott when it has no Rott in it's breeding. That said Iwould love to have a look at these dogs. Would you be kind enough to post the web address. Thanks
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  #3  
Old 01-10-2003, 11:00 AM
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All I have to say is "yuck". What a nasty little money making scheme. Can you link us to the website you are talking about? I did a Google search on "Chaplin Pinschers" and I didn't find anything.
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  #4  
Old 01-10-2003, 11:18 AM
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I did the same Miabella and nothing. Would still like a look though. Site addy Pleeeease. Thanks
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  #5  
Old 01-10-2003, 11:19 AM
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My apologies - they are called a Carlin Pincher. Here is a site I found with some picts - http://glamourzon.tripod.com/pug-pin.html

They make reference to the dogs not being miniature rotties, just looking like them....Gee - seems as though someone thought of a way to turn our wonderful breed into a lapdog. Sickening. You know the only reason people are going to buy this dog is because is looks like a mini rottie...unbelieveable.

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  #6  
Old 01-10-2003, 12:50 PM
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These dogs are not advertised as mini rotties, it simply says that their resemblance to the rottweiler was no mistake. I guess they like to color,build of a rottie but no the size. It was OTHER people who started calling these dogs mini rotties. Kind of like OTHER people started calling smaller sized aussies mini aussies. They say on their webpage that the CP is not related to the rottweiler. I think they are cute and wouldn't mind having one someday. These people are doign things right, they are health testing their dogs and have created their own registry, how do you think we got rottweilers? Or any other breed of dog for that matter. At least these people are doing things the correct way by writing out a standard and breeding according to their standard, instead of the other so called new breed the Labradoodle who breed any poodle and lab together and sell the puppies to anyone with $800-$1000, the waiting list for Carlin Pinschers is very long (2+ years) and the homes are screened closely because these people really want to go somewhere with this breed instead of just being the fad of the decade, I know this all for a fact because I have been in contact with the breed club.
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  #7  
Old 01-10-2003, 12:57 PM
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Why is it sickening? If they're being organized and careful about their breeding so that they turn out mentally and physically sound dogs with an eye toward recognition (which it seems like they're doing), I see nothing wrong with it (but I've beaten THAT dead horse more than once, and I think people who are opposed to new breeds are just opposed to new breeds, no matter HOW carefully people go about it). Nobody complains about Manchester Terriers or Shelties, which look like (but aren't) small versions of bigger breeds, and nobody complains about Miniature Dachshunds, either.

I completely agree with what Goniella said, just because some guy you overheard called them "mini Rotties" doesn't mean anything. So what if they like the way Rotties look and tried to reproduce it in a different breed? It's not going to hurt Rotties anymore than "mini Collies" (i.e. Shelties) hurt Collies.
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  #8  
Old 01-10-2003, 01:02 PM
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spidey, perhaps you should take a look at the breeding discussion forum, http://groups.yahoo.com/group/carlinpinscher/, where many Carlin Pinscher breeders and promoters are actively using the term "mini rottie" for this mix. Whatever your feelings are about purposely creating mixed breed dogs, I hope you will agree that it is unethical for them to be promoting these dogs as "mini rotties".
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  #9  
Old 01-10-2003, 01:06 PM
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That link doesn't work, Miabella, could you double-check it? Thanks. :)

Oh, and I have to point out that ALL breeds were purposely created "mixed-breed dogs" at some point. And some are still outcrossed to other breeds from time to time for the purposes of expanding the gene pool and thus making the breed more robust (ISTR that this is currently being done with the Russian Black Terrier being outcrossed to Schnauzers). If they're actually calling them mini-Rotties, I don't know that I consider it unethical (any more than Sheltie breeders calling their dogs "mini-Collies"), but it's certainly inaccurate. If they're serious about getting the breed recognized, it will be clearly stated in more than one location that the breed is NOT a mini Rottie, just as it states in most places that MinPins aren't mini Dobies and Shelties aren't mini Collies.
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  #10  
Old 01-10-2003, 01:08 PM
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Sorry about that

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/carlinpinscher/

A comma somehow got inserted at the end of the url in my last post. It should work now.
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  #11  
Old 01-10-2003, 01:20 PM
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Irony!

There is a discussion about this topic there at the head of the list, and there are many people clearly stating that the dog should not be called a mini Rottie (I can find one person defending calling them that, and many people disagreeing, and one person who seems to be developing the breed who is not respected by the others who refers to them that way). I'm sure you'll agree that not all people involved with any breed are people you'd agree with, or who represent their breed fairly or accurately.

It also seems that they may have given up on developing this breed, going by some of the posts.
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  #12  
Old 01-10-2003, 03:50 PM
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I guess I'm a bit confused then. They state that they don't want the dogs to be called mini rotties , but yet, on their site they state, " Their resemblance to a Rotweiller is no accident, they were bred with that in mind, but they are not closely related to Rotties, and are bred to serve a much different purpose. "

Perhaps they should have said - they are NOT related to rotties - the above statement leads one to believe they are related.
(Forgive me if there is a close relation between the minpin, pug and rottie - I plead ingnorace! :) )

I see nothing wrong with taking the sound road to establishing a new breed - that said, I bristle at the thought of the dogs being referred to as a mini rottie. The breed Rottweiler carries a very distict reputation To use the breeds name in association with the CP is misleading. They may appear to look alike, however I'm sure their temprements are worlds apart. Maybe the breeders aren't calling them mini rotties, but John Q. Public sure will!
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  #13  
Old 01-10-2003, 06:12 PM
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Here let me clear things up a bit for you Emme


Quote:
Their resemblance to a Rotweiller is no accident, they were bred with that in mind, but they are not closely related to Rotties, and are bred to serve a much different purpose. "

Ok they say the resemblance to the rottie is no accident. This is because they share the same color traits, they wanted the same color traits. But the CP also comes in chocolate,isabella (fawn) and red with tan points and also in solid black solid red and also STAG red (red with black hairs mixed in).

Not closely related to rottweilers means just that, To say that they are not related to rottweilers would also be a lie, because in fact all dogs are related they are all in the same species under the genus Canis domesticus (meaning domestic dog), they are all of the same family, the different breeds and traits we see today are just different degrees of seperation. Does that help a bit?
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  #14  
Old 01-10-2003, 06:19 PM
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Maybe the breeders aren't calling them mini rotties, but John Q. Public sure will!
Well yeah, but John Q. Public is ignorant about a whole lot of things. :) All you can do is try to educate him. I can't count the number of times I've had to explain that a Sheltie isn't a mini Collie, or that a MinPin isn't a mini Dobie (nor is it a Manchester Terrier), etc. But I don't see how it makes any difference what John Q. Public thinks in terms of the dogs themselves - an educated buyer will be educated and an ignorant buyer will be ignorant, this is true no matter what breed we're talking about. They bred these dogs to look like miniature Rotties, but they're NOT miniature Rotties, as is made clear by the comments on that page. Anyone who will insist that they have a "mini Rottie", when there's no such thing, is ignorant, but I don't see how it affects Rottweilers OR these "Carlin Pinschers" to have some people with misconceptions about them. People have misconceptions far worse than that, which ARE actually harmful (misconceptions which lead to breed bans, for example), this seems pretty harmless to me.
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  #15  
Old 01-10-2003, 06:39 PM
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<<<shaking head>>>
<<sigh>> :(
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