Rottweiler Discussion Forums

Go Back   Rottweiler Discussion Forums > Rottweiler > Breeding
Did you forget your password? Reset it here


Breeding Just about anything related to breeding should go here. Please remember, litter announcements are fine, but puppies/dogs for sale, through posts or links, are strictly prohibited. The discussion of breeders is not permited.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09-16-2011, 09:00 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: NJ, USA
Thoughts on this breeding?

As a first-time poster but long-term lurker, I would love some feedback on the following breeding:

Medoc vom Maulbeergraben x Xara vom Mariannenthal


This will be our first rott. We are looking for a rott to be a member of our family, living in our home with our 2 yo and 4 yo girls as well as our 3 cats. I plan on working with the dog/titling in obedience, schutzhund, therapy, and maybe even sar and agility.

Thanks for your help!
Reply With Quote
Members of Rottweiler Discussion Forums have rated post 1022995 as the most helpful. Skip right to it!
 
  #2  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:32 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: PA
Images: 7
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

I highly recommend you do not purchase a pup from this litter or breeder. I can not go into details of my experience with him, but I strongly suggest you look elsewhere. I will, however, tell you what I KNOW about the dam of this litter...
Xara may be a carrier of the SAS gene. She herself was cleared, however, I know her last litter produced 3 pups with it. I understand she had a litter in Germany that all died, most likely SAS. And her second litter in Germany produced many pups with Hip Displaysia. Avoid this breeding at all costs. Not worth your time, effort, or money. Unfortunately, here we can not give breeder suggestions, but you DO NOT want a puppy from this breeding(er) ever.
Reply With Quote


  #3  
Old 09-17-2011, 10:04 AM
brunie's mom's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Ontario, Canada
Images: 4
Post Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vom Schattanberge View Post
I highly recommend you do not purchase a pup from this litter or breeder. I can not go into details of my experience with him, but I strongly suggest you look elsewhere. I will, however, tell you what I KNOW about the dam of this litter...
Xara may be a carrier of the SAS gene. She herself was cleared, however, I know her last litter produced 3 pups with it. I understand she had a litter in Germany that all died, most likely SAS. And her second litter in Germany produced many pups with Hip Displaysia. Avoid this breeding at all costs. Not worth your time, effort, or money. Unfortunately, here we can not give breeder suggestions, but you DO NOT want a puppy from this breeding(er) ever.
Just want to clarify what you said here. I went to the OFA site and her heart has been checked...but by a regular vet...not a cardiologist vet. Getting this type of clearance means nothing.
Also I guess both the male and female are European..and may have hip and elbow clearances been done in Europe?? Since the dogs are being bred in the US, they should also have them done in the US.

The male also has a cataract on his eye from his CERF report.

Since there has been problems with the puppies produced by the female...and there is no history of heart clearances...I would stay away from this breeding.

Gina
__________________
~~~


(Baxter)Weka's Knight'N' Shinin Armor CGN TT HIC
(Jemma) Eirian's First Class Jem HIC CGN
Duncan (Rescue)~A work in progress
* * * * * *
At the Bridge:
Bruno
Teddy
China
Reply With Quote


  #4  
Old 09-17-2011, 10:46 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: PA
Images: 7
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

I can not possibly stress this enough....there are many better breeders out there, IMO. My experience with this breeder.....leaves much to be desired. I have seen pups produced by this male...one is on my property....not good. Just do not do this to yourself or your family. Keep searching. Don't go there. Please do not go this route.
Reply With Quote


  #5  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:59 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sparta, NJ
Images: 13
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Welcome to the forum. I would strongly recommend that you listen to everyone that is telling you to stay clear of this breeder, I don't personally know him/her but what everyone is saying his dogs produce problems. SAS is a serious problem and should not be taken lightly and if she already had two litters with problems, DO NOT PURCHASE A PUPPY FROM THEM. By the way where is NJ are you located there is a show coming up Oct 14 to 17 in Augusta NJ where you can meet breeders and talk to different people and hopefully find your new addition.
__________________
Shalimar
Reply With Quote


  #6  
Old 09-17-2011, 09:27 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: New Hampshire
Images: 15
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Heed well the advice you've received.

Years ago I had a lovely 21 mo old bitch puppy die in front of my eyes. She was jumping up to play with my male when she made an odd whimpering sound. She looked as tho her bones had melted. By the time she hit the floor she was dead.

I had her autopsied, but the vet couldn't tell me anything.

Knowing what I now know, it was likely SAS that killed her.
__________________
Rescue Rottweiler: NERR&R

UCDX North Eastís Full of Moxie CDX, RE, CS, NEDDC NDD, BMDCA DD, NWPD, TT, CGC, TDI, HIC
December ? 1999 - November 7, 2011
Reply With Quote


  #7  
Old 09-18-2011, 04:36 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Images: 9
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelBunny View Post
Heed well the advice you've received.

Years ago I had a lovely 21 mo old bitch puppy die in front of my eyes. She was jumping up to play with my male when she made an odd whimpering sound. She looked as tho her bones had melted. By the time she hit the floor she was dead.

I had her autopsied, but the vet couldn't tell me anything.

Knowing what I now know, it was likely SAS that killed her.
Oh my god this is awful I am in NZ so know NOTHING about this breeder but would recommend you listen to those that do. I would never get over it if something like this happened to one of my dogs, heartbreaking
Reply With Quote


  #8  
Old 09-18-2011, 10:46 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: NJ, USA
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Thanks to everyone who posted. I will definitely heed your advice and keep looking (and learning). I am so grateful for this forum and for the help from this community!
Reply With Quote


  #9  
Old 09-19-2011, 08:07 AM
Novice Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Glen Spey, New York United States
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Hello My name is Sandy Barone. I am the owners of both Medoc and Xara. This discussion was brought to my attention and I wanted to respond to it. Vom Schattanberge claims that he has a dog out of my male Medoc that is no good. What is no good about him? Is he sick, not show quality? Did you buy a show dog? If you have a problem have you contacted me? If you did then did I not try to resolve the problem? I wish you would post your name or send me an email about your problem. In reference to Xara losing most of her litter in Germany that is true. Xara did not show signs of going into labor and the previous owner to did not take her to a vet till the 68 day and the pups were dead inside her by that time. In reference to her second litter having many dogs that have a hip problem what are the names of those dogs? This is the first time I am hearing this and will look into it. Now in her previous litter when she was bred to a German stud dog Utz vom Hause Anin there was a puppy with a heart problem. I imediatley paid for the puppys vet and cardioligist bill and offered to give the purchase price of the puppy back to the buyer. But she wanted more then 3 times then what she paid for the puppy back as in her words to go away. I refused to be extorted and told her I would only give her back the amount she paid for the puppy and the 2 vet bills I paid totaling over $500.00 She took me to court and the judge gave her exactly what I offered to give her. The money she paid for the puppy. From time to time there will be puppies with problems even if the parents and grandparents may be clear of these problems. What is important is the breeder stands behind it. I stand behind my dogs 100% As you can see with all my dogs they they have there hips and elbows done before they are bred. USRC requires that only one of the two either sire or dam only has to have a breed test to be bred. If you look at my previous breedings you will see that both sire and dams have had breed test before they were bred. Most of my dogs also are Schutzhund titled. Only in one litter was there only one who did not and that was because I imported the female from Germany already bred before I purchased her. My dogs get the best vet care, are fed the best food ( Orijen ) out there and get much love and attention. If at anytime I see a dog of mine is producing a genetic problem I will stop breeding that dog immediately and have that dog fixed so it can not be bred again. If anyone has a question feel free to either email me at personal contact info removed by Admin Again Vom Schattenberge if you let me know who you are and what your problem is with a dog you have from one of my breeding's I will try my best to make things right.

Sandy Barone

Last edited by Vista; 09-19-2011 at 12:48 PM.
Reply With Quote


1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
  #10  
Old 09-19-2011, 08:18 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Niskayuna NY USA
Images: 36
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

People from all over the world have bred to Medoc and still do. As for Xara, maybe the studs she has been bred to that produce problems but then again maybe not. It just does not seem right to tell people about all these bad puppies on a public forum without proof. BOTH dogs have a AD which is a pretty good test of a dogs heart and endurance. Both dogs have ZTP and ScH 3 so both should be fairly healthy and have a nice stable temperament. Two very healthy world champions can and do produce bad pups at times. One person has a bad experience and bull crap can and does get spread all over the internet.

Did Sandy not make good or offer to make good on any bad puppies ? Not many breeders anywhere in the world make perfect pups 100% of the time and if there was, that breeder would have everyones business and nobody else would need to breed a dog.

Yeah, someone got a bad puppy but don't forget to add that the breeder paid all the vet bills including a heart check ( echo ) , offered a refund, and allowed the pup to stay with the buyer. When stuff does happen it is nice to find a breeder like that. I'm not defending him or the health tests he does or does not do, just stating the facts. Two perfect dogs WITH all their health tests can and do produce problem puppies. Two dogs from the pound without any tests could produce perfect pups. Mother nature has the final say
__________________
Multi V Ian's XL vom Hause Walker
Multi V Izzy vom Wesburg
Rayna vom Frankenblick
Bronco Andy's Gretchen
T-Rex
Shrek
rescue Dylan
Always remembered MeMo and Chase
Reply With Quote


4 out of 4 members found this post helpful.
  #11  
Old 09-19-2011, 11:15 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Purcellville, Virginia
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

If this is your first Rottweiler I highly recommend you seek out a working dog club in your area and hang out for a few training sessions. This breeding has some very good working blood and you should witness what it is you are getting into. If you don't, you will be on here posting about your "AGGRESSIVE (insert age) PUPPY". You have young children in your home and you need to KNOW what you are getting into. In another thread I posted contact info for T. Floyd, also look up the United States Rottweiler Club and United Schutzhund clubs of America to help locate several clubs and check them out.

As far as the breeder comments that have been posted, I say keep them in mind but for every bad experience there is also a good experience. 2 sides to every story.

Also if you are interested in driving down to Virginia, the USRC Schutzhund National Championship's are November 4-6 in Leesburg, VA.

Good luck in your search for a Rottweiler puppy!
Reply With Quote


1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
  #12  
Old 09-19-2011, 01:06 PM
brunie's mom's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Ontario, Canada
Images: 4
Question Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Quote:
Originally Posted by niteday654 View Post
Hello My name is Sandy Barone. I am the owners of both Medoc and Xara. This discussion was brought to my attention and I wanted to respond to it. Vom Schattanberge claims that he has a dog out of my male Medoc that is no good. What is no good about him? Is he sick, not show quality? Did you buy a show dog? If you have a problem have you contacted me? If you did then did I not try to resolve the problem? I wish you would post your name or send me an email about your problem. In reference to Xara losing most of her litter in Germany that is true. Xara did not show signs of going into labor and the previous owner to did not take her to a vet till the 68 day and the pups were dead inside her by that time. In reference to her second litter having many dogs that have a hip problem what are the names of those dogs? This is the first time I am hearing this and will look into it. Now in her previous litter when she was bred to a German stud dog Utz vom Hause Anin there was a puppy with a heart problem. I imediatley paid for the puppys vet and cardioligist bill and offered to give the purchase price of the puppy back to the buyer. But she wanted more then 3 times then what she paid for the puppy back as in her words to go away. I refused to be extorted and told her I would only give her back the amount she paid for the puppy and the 2 vet bills I paid totaling over $500.00 She took me to court and the judge gave her exactly what I offered to give her. The money she paid for the puppy. From time to time there will be puppies with problems even if the parents and grandparents may be clear of these problems. What is important is the breeder stands behind it. I stand behind my dogs 100% As you can see with all my dogs they they have there hips and elbows done before they are bred. USRC requires that only one of the two either sire or dam only has to have a breed test to be bred. If you look at my previous breedings you will see that both sire and dams have had breed test before they were bred. Most of my dogs also are Schutzhund titled. Only in one litter was there only one who did not and that was because I imported the female from Germany already bred before I purchased her. My dogs get the best vet care, are fed the best food ( Orijen ) out there and get much love and attention. If at anytime I see a dog of mine is producing a genetic problem I will stop breeding that dog immediately and have that dog fixed so it can not be bred again. If anyone has a question feel free to either email me at personal contact info removed by Admin Again Vom Schattenberge if you let me know who you are and what your problem is with a dog you have from one of my breeding's I will try my best to make things right.

Sandy Barone
I'm glad that you came here and gave us some more information.
Curious to know if there was a puppy born to your female with heart problems, why you have not had both your male and female cleared of heart problems?? I see on the OFA site, that the hearts have only been listened to by a 'practitioner'....I would think they would have been cleared by a specialist vet? since problems have shown up??? Also very few dogs in the pedigree have heart clearances.
__________________
~~~


(Baxter)Weka's Knight'N' Shinin Armor CGN TT HIC
(Jemma) Eirian's First Class Jem HIC CGN
Duncan (Rescue)~A work in progress
* * * * * *
At the Bridge:
Bruno
Teddy
China
Reply With Quote


  #13  
Old 09-19-2011, 01:10 PM
LavenderRott's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Michigan
Images: 32
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Quote:
Originally Posted by niteday654 View Post
Hello My name is Sandy Barone. I am the owners of both Medoc and Xara. This discussion was brought to my attention and I wanted to respond to it. Vom Schattanberge claims that he has a dog out of my male Medoc that is no good. What is no good about him? Is he sick, not show quality? Did you buy a show dog? If you have a problem have you contacted me? If you did then did I not try to resolve the problem? I wish you would post your name or send me an email about your problem. In reference to Xara losing most of her litter in Germany that is true. Xara did not show signs of going into labor and the previous owner to did not take her to a vet till the 68 day and the pups were dead inside her by that time. In reference to her second litter having many dogs that have a hip problem what are the names of those dogs? This is the first time I am hearing this and will look into it. Now in her previous litter when she was bred to a German stud dog Utz vom Hause Anin there was a puppy with a heart problem. I imediatley paid for the puppys vet and cardioligist bill and offered to give the purchase price of the puppy back to the buyer. But she wanted more then 3 times then what she paid for the puppy back as in her words to go away. I refused to be extorted and told her I would only give her back the amount she paid for the puppy and the 2 vet bills I paid totaling over $500.00 She took me to court and the judge gave her exactly what I offered to give her. The money she paid for the puppy. From time to time there will be puppies with problems even if the parents and grandparents may be clear of these problems. What is important is the breeder stands behind it. I stand behind my dogs 100% As you can see with all my dogs they they have there hips and elbows done before they are bred. USRC requires that only one of the two either sire or dam only has to have a breed test to be bred. If you look at my previous breedings you will see that both sire and dams have had breed test before they were bred. Most of my dogs also are Schutzhund titled. Only in one litter was there only one who did not and that was because I imported the female from Germany already bred before I purchased her. My dogs get the best vet care, are fed the best food ( Orijen ) out there and get much love and attention. If at anytime I see a dog of mine is producing a genetic problem I will stop breeding that dog immediately and have that dog fixed so it can not be bred again. If anyone has a question feel free to either email me at personal contact info removed by Admin Again Vom Schattenberge if you let me know who you are and what your problem is with a dog you have from one of my breeding's I will try my best to make things right.

Sandy Barone
You state that you have their hips and elbows checked but you don't mention hearts. Do you get hearts tested?
__________________
Sandi

Chase - Forever in my heart
Sky Valley's Mythic Dreamer aka Stark
Reply With Quote


  #14  
Old 09-19-2011, 07:54 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: NJ, USA
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Sandy, thanks so much for posting here, and I am glad you had an opportunity to set the record straight. I am definitely interested in reading your responses to the questions posed by Bruniesmom and Lavenderrott.
Reply With Quote


  #15  
Old 09-20-2011, 02:30 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Santa Maria, CA
Images: 8
Re: Thoughts on this breeding?

Quote:
Originally Posted by brunie's mom View Post
I'm glad that you came here and gave us some more information.
Curious to know if there was a puppy born to your female with heart problems, why you have not had both your male and female cleared of heart problems?? I see on the OFA site, that the hearts have only been listened to by a 'practitioner'....I would think they would have been cleared by a specialist vet? since problems have shown up??? Also very few dogs in the pedigree have heart clearances.
I will say that hearts have not been being checked for many years, and are STILL not heavily checked in most dogs. It absolutely should be one of the standard health checks, but we are having a hard time even getting the hips and elbows done, much less hearts and eyes. MANY will have the hearts checked by a "practitioner" and only move beyond that if there is a problem.

Beyond that, correct me if I am wrong, but these dogs are European dogs. It is even less common to have hearts and eyes checked there. The current owner cannot force the owners of the dogs parents and grandparents get their dogs checked in addition to her own. Now if this bitch has produced a pup with SAS, then a repeat breeding would be in appropriate. But not all murmurs are SAS and not all are an inherited deficiency. Sometimes they are a fluke.

Quote:
Xara may be a carrier of the SAS gene. She herself was cleared, however, I know her last litter produced 3 pups with it. I understand she had a litter in Germany that all died, most likely SAS.
"Mays" and "most likelys" are not fair. If you know of a dog personally, then by all means, speak up, but vague innuendos are no bueno. Nothing about how this bitch lost a litter sounds like SAS, and if three of her pups have SAS, what are their names?

I don't know. In this situation I would go over board in making sure she has been tested up the toosh for the standards and then some, but I also want hard facts not shadows and accusations...

I too want to hear how the breeder here answers the questions posed.
__________________
Be as gentle as possible and as firm as necessary
Reply With Quote


Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
some advice/thoughts on this breeding!? rambo101 Breeding 8 08-13-2011 11:09 PM
Rambling thoughts on pure breed mentality, purpose and breeding. Howard33 General Info 18 05-13-2010 11:37 AM
Thoughts on breeding, underage bitches, etc. BostonRott Breeding 1 02-01-2003 06:00 AM
Breeding - Scary Thoughts RottQueen Breeding 2 11-24-2001 04:46 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:16 PM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.

The thoughts expressed in the interviews and/or commentary contained within these forums are solely those of the individual(s) providing them and do not represent and/or reflect the opinions of Rottweiler Dot Net, it's parent site or it's affiliates.

Copyright © 1998 - 2013 Rottweiler Discussion Forums-All Rights Reserved - No part of this site may be reproduced without permission.