Starting to breed...

[Cdn1050]

I can handle cleaning up puppy mess from one puppy, but having to clean up puppy pee and feces from 2+ puppies for 8 weeks every time a mess is made which would be a lot, and all the preparation prior to the birth of the puppies (health certs, showing + titling, finding a stud that would compliment the bitch, etc...) would be enough to turn me off of breeding any dogs. Sorry but that's JMO!

[FilosFolks]

Where, oh where, is Princessmom...???

Please read, read, read the stickies, at the very least...

This is not the game of "Life" and you spin the wheel.

Ailee

[Luvtails]

The OP never said he/she wasn't going to do things the right way. In fact he/she states that genetic testing will be done and seems to be willing to do whatever is needed. hopefully the OP will read and learn about Rotties and go to a show to learn about conformation and temperment. The OP also never stated that the dogs were from the same breeder or a BYB. For all you know the OP could have bought the dogs from different COE breeders. Before you jump all over someone maybe you should have ALL the facts. I am not defending the breeding of "nice dogs" to have "nice pups" but what if his dogs are nice? To all of you COE breeders, weren't you a beginner at one time? Every one of you started somewhere. This person could turn out to be a good COE breeder in the future due to proper guidance in the beginning.

To the OP:
Before you breed you must have hip/elbows cert by OFA or the registry for your country, eyes cleared by CERF and OFA cardiac clearence. info can be found at Orthopedic Foundation for Animals

this would mean regardless of how many heats a dog has she can not be bred before the age of 2. Same goes for a male.

You should also have your dogs evaluated for conformation and temperment by entering them in conformation shows. you can get info about where shows are at Home Page, InfoDog -? The Dog Fancier's Complete Resource for information? AKC Dog Show Events, and Dog Products and Services
go and observe the Rotties.

[FilosFolks]

I think the reasoning behind the responses is the OPs sixth month old untried puppies and already envisioning wanting to breed them. Papered or not, willing to do whatever, or not...

Yes, everyone has some beginning somewhere but it is not with six month olds or how much you'd love to see them have a litter of your very own.

In actual fact this thread should be started and these questions asked if and when these dogs deserve to be bred, IMHO.

Ailee

[Shelby427]

Originally Posted by JagerLiLi

Thank you for all of your post!! Some harsh some not so harsh. I appreciate them all though... The breeding of this breed IS a HARSH reality as well as the conciquences of BYB... There is no arguing that point! This is what I'm saying, I would NEVER breed them without getting them cleared health wise. I know there are many clearances you must get to completely get the OK for breeding, this is not mandatory but it is for me. I'm not arguing this! I don't want to produce a genetically ill pet for anyone! If I have to wait until they are two years of age before breeding, then that's fine. So that means I will skip the second and even the third heat! Also, there is a local university vet here where I live and they are very good at what they do. You can leave your animal there to have the pups. I do want to start showing my male. I do all of the training myself but have yet been to a show. They do not come from a champion bloodline that I know of. In fact it was BYB's. They had a great set up and had great standard sized dogs. I do wish I knew about the health issues with the breed though! These are my 5th and 6th rottweilers... I am 23 years old and have not done much research on them until I got these two. I had a male die at 8months due to a heart attack. I thought this was due to a possible inbreed, but in fact prolly an irresponsible BYB. I was 13 years old and was super attached to the dog. I also had one we had to put to sleep due to cancer. This I wish on nobody! I dont know why it's a big deal that Im rasing two pups at the same time? They are extremely attached to me and my gf. They would rather be with us than each other and there is no doubt about that! If they are not to the "standard" I will not breed them together. My next Rott will be one from an approved breeder with health certs. Again I appreciate all post, and take none of them negatively! This is supposed to be why we post. To get all of the knowledgeable replys!! I have a year and a half to decide whether or not to breed my two. Thanks again!

No you don't have a year and a half! You got your dogs from a BYB!!! You do not know if there are any recessive genes that your dogs are carrying! Just because you don't think so, you are indeed going to be a BYB. You need to get dogs from a COE breeder, show your them, title them before breeding! You should NOT be breeding these two that you have now!

[JagerLiLi]

Thank you tails for providing me with some of the health links that I was looking for! Ailee... I would rather have gathered all of the information, before I breed, and before they are ready to breed. I wan't as much information one could retain before they are ready. They are actually 4.5 and 5months. Cleaning behind pups is not a problem at all! This has no benefit for what I want to do, but I actually came close to getting into vet school. I know we are all animal lovers here! I located a place to take my dogs for their CGC. I just need to find out, what's all expected of my rotts to qualify. Thanks for your post!

[Shelby427]

Originally Posted by Luvtails

The OP never said he/she wasn't going to do things the right way. In fact he/she states that genetic testing will be done and seems to be willing to do whatever is needed. hopefully the OP will read and learn about Rotties and go to a show to learn about conformation and temperment. The OP also never stated that the dogs were from the same breeder or a BYB. For all you know the OP could have bought the dogs from different COE breeders. Before you jump all over someone maybe you should have ALL the facts. I am not defending the breeding of "nice dogs" to have "nice pups" but what if his dogs are nice? To all of you COE breeders, weren't you a beginner at one time? Every one of you started somewhere. This person could turn out to be a good COE breeder in the future due to proper guidance in the beginning.

To the OP:
Before you breed you must have hip/elbows cert by OFA or the registry for your country, eyes cleared by CERF and OFA cardiac clearence. info can be found at Orthopedic Foundation for Animals

this would mean regardless of how many heats a dog has she can not be bred before the age of 2. Same goes for a male.

You should also have your dogs evaluated for conformation and temperment by entering them in conformation shows. you can get info about where shows are at Home Page, InfoDog -? The Dog Fancier's Complete Resource for information? AKC Dog Show Events, and Dog Products and Services
go and observe the Rotties.

Yes she did: They do not come from a champion bloodline that I know of. In fact it was BYB's.

[JagerLiLi]

Shelby, its a he... tails thank you for the health links!

[Skip]

It is has been explained to you in detail, several times, from knowledgeable people, why you should definitely NOT breed these two...ever.

Now, why do you want to still consider it a possibility down the road? Did you not come here to learn the right thing to do?

[JagerLiLi]

What if I find out that these dogs are not genetically ill? What if these dogs are amazingly perfect proportioned dogs? What if all of these things fall in place? Just because their parents arent 9 time grand champions, I shouldn't breed them? Because I can't find time to attend a show in a different city every week, I shouldn't breed them? I understand the carelessness of our breeds community in producing puppies to make money. I understand that's why there are so many health problems within our breed. A lot of people dont concern themselves with the health of the breed. To be PERFECTLY HONEST a lot of people are clueless to the genetic health issues of the Rott! IT IS TRUELY SAD and I am victim to being an owner of a genetically ill rott, heck make it TWO. Both Fatal! I came here to get some insight, options, opinions, and information. I even expected a bit of a debate about it. Once again, I'm not breeding these two if these things dont fall in place. Like you said, it has be explained to me, several times, from knowledgeable people. Its also been explained by me several times, my intentions, and concerns they are one of the same. The overall well being of my two dogs and any puppies they give to this world is my number ONE concern! Once again, I will not breed them if there is one thing not right or one thing I can not prove. They are not even 6 months yet. Breeding is a long ways off IF they are bred. That is a lot of time from now to prove or disprove "worthyness" of breeding. I appreciate all of your opinions and will use everyone of them in my final decision. But getting mad and replying in a rude manner makes no sense... Im not exactly sure why my last three post did not go through?

[Luvtails]

Shelby 427,
Sorry, I missed the post that stated they were from a BYB with no clearences. I just try to give people the benefit of the doubt. Hopefully she will spay/neuter these 2 pups and get involved with showing training these 2 and search for good dogs to begin a breeding program with. To the OP. you can still have fun with these 2. Most of my dogs are spayed as I enjoy the obedience end of showing.

[Luvtails]

Your dogs might be able to pass health clearences but what about their parents/ grandparents etc.. do you know anything about them? I have a female right now who is 2 from solid Health tested lines. She still needs her health clearences and I am showing her in an upcomming show. I know she is nice but I want a judges opinion. Also I plan on placing either obedience or working titles on her first. Either way, Her LINES are solid with generations of health tested dogs. By breeding unknown pedigrees problems can come out in your pups. Cardiac problems, eye problems, etc... I would look for a dog from sound pedigree to begin a breeding program.

[leanershnitzel]

You can't prove or disprove their breed worthiness,because they are not registerd. You can't show them and you can't get a ofa rating. You can however get them an appointment at the vet to get speutered!

[alice's mommy]

JagerLiLi: perhaps you missed the post about the fact that there could be RECESSIVE genes in your pups with genetic illnesses that you WON'T BE AWARE OF! If you knew the bloodlines/history/genetic make-up of these pups, then that's a different story, but since they're from a BYB, you can't know that! You could very well breed very ill puppies, even if YOUR two pups appear healthy in a vet examination.

[Shelby427]

Originally Posted by JagerLiLi

What if I find out that these dogs are not genetically ill? What if these dogs are amazingly perfect proportioned dogs? What if all of these things fall in place? Just because their parents arent 9 time grand champions, I shouldn't breed them? Because I can't find time to attend a show in a different city every week, I shouldn't breed them? I understand the carelessness of our breeds community in producing puppies to make money. I understand that's why there are so many health problems within our breed. A lot of people dont concern themselves with the health of the breed. To be PERFECTLY HONEST a lot of people are clueless to the genetic health issues of the Rott! IT IS TRUELY SAD and I am victim to being an owner of a genetically ill rott, heck make it TWO. Both Fatal! I came here to get some insight, options, opinions, and information. I even expected a bit of a debate about it. Once again, I'm not breeding these two if these things dont fall in place. Like you said, it has be explained to me, several times, from knowledgeable people. Its also been explained by me several times, my intentions, and concerns they are one of the same. The overall well being of my two dogs and any puppies they give to this world is my number ONE concern! Once again, I will not breed them if there is one thing not right or one thing I can not prove. They are not even 6 months yet. Breeding is a long ways off IF they are bred. That is a lot of time from now to prove or disprove "worthyness" of breeding. I appreciate all of your opinions and will use everyone of them in my final decision. But getting mad and replying in a rude manner makes no sense... Im not exactly sure why my last three post did not go through?

You still should not breed! You have no idea about the sire and dam of your puppies since they were from a BYB - so both parents may have a genetic fault that you're unaware of. Your puppies *might* be ok, but that's not enough! You need to know the lineage of the dogs to check to see if any of them in the pedigree have heart problems, eye problems etc. Just because your dog may be healthy does not mean you should breed! The grandparents, great grandparents, aunts, uncles etc allllll must have the same clearances!