white spots on chest

[rottweilerlovers]

hi i have a question about white spots on chest area my dog recently had puppys and 9 out of 11 of them has white on their chests some more white then others this has me very curious because my rotts dont have any white and their parents didnt either, I dont think this is going to go away as they get older either .Does any one know where this white came from? my dogs are full blooded and registerd and definetly not related I was told this was german blood line and a good one has anyone else ever heard of this? or is this a bad thing ?are they still able to be registerd ?please any imfo will help regarding this thanks

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rottweilerlovers thanks for replying im still wondering how they got them does anyone know a full grown rott with white on thier chest area ?

[This message has been edited by rottweilerlovers (edited February 08, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by rottweilerlovers (edited February 08, 2000).]

[jlc]

l would personally be worried if that many had whit spots. but alot of rotts do have whit spots that fade.not a major thing not everyone breeds for show nor would l be that worried you could mate them again and know whit spots could appear

[jlc]

l would,nt worry if your not breeding for show etc

[3rottys]

A few of our pups had white spots on their chests, but they eventually lost them.

[Orville Story]

rottweilerlovers,
It is not uncommon for one or two pups out of a litter to have a little white on the chest. To have this many pups with white tells you that both the sire and dam carry the recessive gene that would cause white on the chest. This is the result of poor breeding practises.

Whenever I have a pup born with white on the chest, I make notes of it on the registration papers and that pup is sold with limited registration.

More than likely both the Sire and Dam of this had spots of white on them a birth and they should not have been used for breed stock.

Your pups can be registered, but you should note the color as Black, Tan with white chest on chest. As the breeder you can register them with a limited registration which would prevent them from continuing to breed this genetic flaw.

[frontierrots]

many many rottweilers carry white genes. You have to have 2 carriers to produce white shots so if you get white then both parents carry it.
Each dogs genes determine how much white is allowed to be expressed

I personally place all pups that were born with any white at all (even if they later outgrew it) as pets on spay/neuter contracts. This practice has all but eliminated any white in my pups. I am down to where if a pup as any white at all it is just 1 pup per litter and it is a teeny spot that is gone by 12 weeks

I do the same with pups born with rear dewclaws- they are also sold as pets even though I remove the dew claws. Since starting this I have reduced my incidence of rear dewclaws from 50% of the pups to ZERO (last 3 litters had none at all) I also do not breed to a studdog that had rear dewclaws. You can alwys tell ifa dog had them as there will be a scar of some sort from the removal-even if it is just a small black hairless spot

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Diane
Frontier Rottweilers & Shiba Inu and
Volunteer with NorthEast Rottweiler Rescue & Referral http://www.rottrescue.org

[rottweilerlovers]

thanks for answering my ?'s i will follow up on the limeted regesrtation you suggjested I traveled very far to get my female rott she comes from a very good bloodline this is sad because they make perfect pups in every other way just these little spots of white condeme them from being naturaul there still perfect in my eyes tho I guess that person that said it was a good german bloodline that carrys this white must of had a few of his own to say that thanks to all who replyed .

I have done alot of research on this topic - both on and off of this forum since the majority of my puppies were born with small white markings on the chest. I wanted to note here that rottweilers originally - before it was attempted to be bred out - did have white on the chest and this was written into the breed standard up until 1921 when the ADRK set the small white markings on the chest and belly as being still accepted but undesirable. Here are some interesting tid bits I found and quote from The Ultimate Rottweiler by Andrew Brace:

"The picture that does emerge is that a good horse can be any colour - and that during the days when the Rottweiler began to make his name it was his courage, intelligence and strength that mattered rather than his appearance."

"It is probable that the white markings have some significance with regard to tempermant. In the ADRK publication "The Rottweiler in Word and Picture" published in 1926, it is pointed out that in the past Rottweilers came in two sizes." "The dog used for cattle herding was considerably smaller and lighter, giving greater agility and endurance and restricting its bite to the lower, less valuable parts of the cattle. The two sizes were kept separate for breeding purposes
and would by today's standards be considered as separate breeds, or as distinct divisions of the same breed. The same ADRK publication states that much more interest was shown in keeping to the present-day colours as far as the large strain was concerned, while with the smaller strain the important characteristic was its working ability with colour being ignored. It goes on to say that because colour was ignored there was no attempt to eliminate the white markings in the smaller strain and that Rottweilers with white markings were more intelligent and biddable. Most of us who know the modern Rottweiler would agree that dogs with small white markings continue to be excellent workers."


In terms of the comments with regard to genetics this quote is also pulled from the same publication:

"Genes are usually given a letter to symbolise them. Conventions suggests that these letters are either upper or lower case and if several versions exist small suffixes are attached. The S series of colour inheritance has the alleles:

1) S solid colour no white
2) si irish spotting (white blaze, chest, feet and collar)
3) sP piebald spotting (white markings irregularly over body)
4) sw extreme white (pure white or with odd patch)


Although very early Rottweilers used to have some white markings - probably Irish spotting - selection against white has led to the virtual disappearance of white markings in the breed and virtually every Rottweiler is SS in genetic make-up. White markings can be seen on chest and toes in young puppies but these often disappear and are minor modifiers of the gene S, not versions of the other alleles. This is an example of breeders over a long period selecting towards a specific goal and changing the frequency of alleles within the breed."

Just a few final thoughts: What if there is a connection between the white markings seen in Rottweilers and working ability??? What if breeders are eliminating good breeding stock from their breeding programs because they do not fully have an understanding of genetics in Rottweilers???

If you get an opportunity pick up the "Ultimate Rottweiler" it is a very good publication and the first I have found with a full section on genetics specific to the rottweiler - very invaluable.

[frontierrots]

I have not found the whte spot/better workers/more bidable to be true. Actually my best herding and obedience workers were born without white and the biggest terrors/obnoxious/troublesome pups/dogs were the ones with the white spots. Pure coincidence and presence or absence of a white spot has nothing at all to do with personality or working ability.
I have also heard that dogs born with rear dewclaws herd better but I have not found this to be true either

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Diane
Frontier Rottweilers & Shiba Inu and
Volunteer with NorthEast Rottweiler Rescue & Referral http://www.rottrescue.org

[Kayla-n-Natas]

Me and my boyfriend have a female with a white stripe starting in the middle of her bowtie, and down about 4inches. We dont mind. She is our little girl. Besides, it kinda makes her one of a kind.

I guess those that write for and are published by the ADRK don't know a whole lot about Rotties then.....LOL http://www.rottweiler.net/rottie/smile.gif

[rottweilerlovers]

thank you all for the imformation i will continue to study this matter further i know the familys my pups are going to will want to know about this as well thank s alot I am going to look for that book to that sounds real helpfull good bye fellow rottweiler lovers from one

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rottweilerlovers

[Carol Burke]

How large are the white spots? If it is just a few hairs they will go away. If the spots are larger then a dime they may stay.

[frontierrots]

Doug & Cheri
I did not say those in the ADRK do not know what they are talking about! You were quoting an article from 1926 about color and working ablity. Dog and genetics and personality knowledge has come a LONG way since 1926! Back then they also believed that a bitch who mismated with a nother breed was ruined for ever and the best wormer was turpentine or tobacco!!

Read some of the more modern studies on dog behavior and inheritance factors and take all the older stuff with a grain of salt

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Diane
Frontier Rottweilers & Shiba Inu and
Volunteer with NorthEast Rottweiler Rescue & Referral http://www.rottrescue.org

I think you missed my point Diane - which was to present some information that was based on both previous study on the subject, as well as scientific research in the case of the section on genetics which was prepared by a geneticist who contributed to the publication that this info derived from.

However to reply to your post, I don't discount research material that is dated unless someone can present me with an equally reputable document or publication that discounts that which was originally published. In this case - you are referring to your own experiences and generalizations about how rottweilers who have or who have had white markings on the chest area are "terrors" - present me with some research and studies which support your findings and I would be very interested to explore this possibility.

Thanks for expressing your opinion.