Mating..umm help plse!!

[NZRottieMum]

Hello again to all you Rottlovers - I dont whether any one remembers but my now just over a year old Sargeant has mated with another female Rotti we adopted. She's about 11 mths old (Xena) and this is the 4th day, they have been mating - oh ohhhh...
I was quite concerned actually, but apparently from her last owners, this is her second time in heat. I called the vet and discussed it with him, he feels that in nearly all cases, they manage to have a successful first litter. I was concerned at the fact that she is too young - your views and experiences are appreciated. By the way...He loves mating her, and she doesnt put up a struggle at all and just lets him go ahead. No doubt, we are going to have a litter of pups, not exactly what we had wanted just yet for them (because of the concern of them being so young) But unfortunately, its too late for that :D
Your views would be appreciated and any advice. This is our first litter of pups to come...ever! :) And no doubt I will be keeping close to the forum for any updates and info. Thanks! ;)

[Deborah Reid]

She is terribly young! It would be like a 10 year old human getting pregnant and being expected to deliver :(
And now you have to face the possibility that not only could having the puppies be very detrimental to your females health, it could kill her! Especially since she is so very young, she is not mature enough physically to carry a litter of puppies without the probability of complications.
I doubt her pelvis is even large enough to deliver the litter, so you will likely need to plan for the possibility of a c-section. And because she is so young, she will most likely not produce enough milk to feed the litter successfully, so you may want to stock up on supplemental formula and other essentials to care for the litter once it is whelped...
Someone posted an excellent story about what can happen to a bitch during pregnancy and whelping, and with this young of a female; it is a distinct probability that any or all of those issues will be faced.
Not only could you be facing the reality of your female dieing, but because, from you post, I do not think you have had any health testing done on either your female or your male, now you are going to have to worry about a plethora of health problems with the puppies :(
Rottweilers face many health issues that are genetic (which means they are heritable)! Hip dysplasia, elbow dysplasia, heart problems, eye diseases, thyroid malfunctions. All of which you can decrease the chance of the likelihood of your puppies having by doing the necessary health screenings on their parents prior to breeding.
Are you going to be able to find all of the puppy’s good homes? What is going to happen to them if you cannot find homes for all of the puppies?
I know you are not going to like it, but my personal advise is to take your female into the vets and have the ova flushed before the pregnancy advances any further, which could start to cause health issues for your female, not to mention what could happen during late gestation and whelping. :( IMHO, people should educate themselves about Rottweilers, Rottweiler health issues and heritable diseases, health testing, breeding Rottweilers, etc, before even thinking about bringing another litter of puppies into the world where so many unwanted puppies already exist. In my opinion the very least you can do is to make sure that you are not passing on any genetic health diseases. :(
I am sorry to be so blunt, but the stark reality is looking us in the face from every humane society and shelter accross the world, and in the veterinary offices where more and more of our beloved breed lays dieing or is being put to sleep because of terrible genetic diseases.
And if that does not move you, I can only hope that the love you may have for your very young female and the risk to her health and the possibility that she may die, will.

[Soapie&Buddy'sMom]

Deborah Reid has said it all, I second it all. you asked for views/advice, here is mine: do as Deborah suggested (basically, abort the female) but I would also add, spay and neuter them both, unless you are going to better the breed. Are you doing that? It doesn't sound like it, from your post.
I'm not sure what things are like in New Zealand, but here in the USA thousands of Rottweilers ("purebred" = like your potential litter) are put to death each year because their so-called owners "couldn't take care of them".
And the breeders were not around to take back the unwanted dogs. :(

[winniecnm]

I agree with the above posts. Spay the bitch NOW and neuter the dog.

First of all, the female is a rescue, too young for a litter, for health clearances or ANYTHING else that should be in place before whelping a PLANNED litter.

Secondly, before any of the above happen for even the most breed worthy dog, the dog's owner needs to be educated in the science of breeding. Such lack of concern for the bitch's health under these circumstances does not show any kind of necessary education.

Please do stick around these forums so that you may learn more of what is required (more than two intact animals) to properly breed Rottweilers and take this advice you have been given VERY seriously.

[damp]

Originally posted by winniecnm
Please do stick around these forums so that you may learn more of what is required (more than two intact animals) to properly breed Rottweilers and take this advice you have been given VERY seriously.

AMEN!!!!!

[NZRottieMum]

well thanks for all the info - And yes, I was planning on getting them (her first) speyed, and then my male. It was unfortunately a situation where they both got together without anyone being around and usually the first time would do it. My dog and the bitch are in perfect health - I have all their health records with me
from the breeders I got him from - Also, with the young bitch I adopted, she was not a rescue situation, so all the records of her from her past owner and the breeder have been passed to me. I appreciate all the information given - it has been very helpful - However in my own defence, I dont like some people making the assumption that I wouldnt be able to find homes or look after the litter and they would probably end up in some shelter or SPCA.
Ive had dogs all my life but have never had any of them, have any litters - hence when I mentioned, this would be the first ever.
I dont want them to have a litter of pups, first of all, I KNOW THAT SHES TOO YOUNG!!!!!!! I just had to get some more info regarding the dangers of it - Ive booked an appointment with another vet _(not my own Ive had for over 10 years) because hes booked out for the next week and a half - and Ive seriously got to get her cleaned out before it progressess any further, and then get him neutered at the same time.
Anyway thanks for the info - I didnt as a dog lover / owner needed to be passed judgement on - just some support and
encouraging words would of done.

[WorkinDogz]

Well it's difficult to encourage in your self-made situation.

Perfect health requires more than "up to date" on vaccinations and not puking or having diarrhea....and more than papers from any breeder.

We won't get into the details; because they aren't important....IF you're going to follow through and have HER SPAYED and him ALTERED.

It's the only responsible and ethical thing to do.

Good luck.

[MARYDVM]

There is no way to "flush the embryos" out after conception has taken place. The only way to stop the pregnancy at this point is to spay her. If this is done during the first 3 weeks after breeding, the procedure is identical to a regular, non-pregnant spay since the embryos are extremely small.

[AngelBunny]

NZRottieMum:

"Your views would be appreciated and any advice."

Did you mislead us in saying the above?

You got advice, you got our views, and it appears you're not happy.

[NZRottieMum]

oh, dont get me wrong - my words asking for advice and views were genuine - and like I mentioned many times, I appreciate it very much - I just dont like the assumption made that Im not doing anything about it and that if she were to have a litter, they wouldnt have homes and that theyd end up in a shelter thats all. But hey..Im happy with the info I got and am going to use it wisely.

[Deborah Reid]

NZRottieMum, first I wanted to say Thank you very much for deciding to not go through with having your little girl whelp, thank you, from someone who loves our breed, as I can see you do as well.
Please understand that people did not mean to be hurtful or to accuse you of anything, all of us on this forum are here because of one thing, our love for our dogs, our love for this wonderful breed, and I am sure you feel the same!
Just the thought of a little 11 month old rottie girl having to go through the trauma of gestation and whelping makes our hearts jump! Not only for the safety and well-being of the puppies, but for the young female and the dangers she is facing.
I know it is not an easy decision, but rest assured, it is the right decision for your girl and for the puppies.
I didn't mean to say that you would put the puppies in shelters or abandon them, there is just so much involved in ethical and concientious breeding it can be overwhelming!
I am sure your vet meant well, but maybe he does not know very much about slow maturing breeds like the Rottweiler when he said that in nearly all cases dogs have a successful first litter. This is true, in mature, healthy dogs, but not the case in this instance.
Your concern about your Rottweiler female being too young was very valid! Whereas a small, fast maturing breed may be close to maturity at 11 months, a Rottweiler is far from it! They are still puppies.
Once again, please accept my sincere thanks for making this hard, but ethical and moral decision. Your little rottie girl will thank you for it too :)

[winniecnm]

You are making a good decision here that is in the best interests of your girl. 11 mo is soo young and though the puppy at that age may even look "big enough" to whelp a litter, mentally and physically she is still a puppy.

Though sometimes the advice you receive on this board may seem a little "rough" (especially in this section) it is usually not intended as a personal attack. Please do stick around!;)

[NZRottieMum]

Well, special thanks to Debrorah Reid, whose advice I have taken regardless of what the vet said.
Yesterday, I arranged with my sister to have Sargeant taken to her fully fenced home for the next 2 weeks until the wee girlie recovers from her operation this morning. Although I had an appointment at another vet elsewhere, I called the SPCA and managed to get her in straight away (it was cheaper too)
Just the thought of something happening to her through a young pregnancy was just to overwhelming - At the moment shes, just lying here on her beanbag - still a little dizzy and unsteady on her feet, but she'll be ok. Sargeant however, will be away from home for a while, away from her. After hes recovered from his visit to the vet for neutering soon, then he can be reunited with her. Sargeant is apparently always sitting by her front gate, and my sister said that hes probably waiting for me to come get him. Hes never been away from me before, and he may be feeling somewhat homesick :( but nevermind, these things take time - and I know, for my two Rotts, I know Ive done the right thing - After all...theyve got the rest of their lives together!!:D
Thanks Deborah and thank you all -

[Barbara Surplus]

NZ, welcome to the forum. It's heartening to know that you've made the decision to not put your girl through an early pregnancy. Hope she recovers well.
Barbara

[JonandMichelle]

Yes indeed. Welcome to our Rottweiler family and THANK YOU for doing the right thing. Not only for your girl, but for the breed. Love is shown in many ways.