Dog Nearly Bites Friend - Urgent Advice Needed

[dipper]

I know of 2 Rottweilers that have been re-homed in the last 3 months that are doing wonderfully ---both were considered dangerous by their previous inexperienced owners.
One of these dogs was owned by a well meaning person on the west coast who wanted to do the best thing for his dog so he flew him all the way to the east coast to give him to knowledgeable Rottweiler people in South Carolina and last report the dog is happy and doing great---this was a dog that attacked 3 people on three separate occasions ---The people in SC have been working with him and TRAINING him and have had no incidents and say he is really a very nice dog. I am not going to go into every little detail but score one for the dogs and the previous owner who went to great lengths to help his dog have a life!!
AND, One of my previous Rottweilers was a dog that had attacked two people.
I knew the dog and what happened and I knew the owners and I KNEW this dog was not unsound and was completely trainable so I took him---he was great for the remaining 8 years of his life that I owned him.
Observer,
You say: " So forgive us if those of us who have been around here a little longer are somewhat more cynical."

I guess you mean by being a member of or on this board a little longer than others...
What the heck does THAT have to do with anything---I like real world experience more than what...board experience??
You and others hear enough stories to speak of what MOST trainers are or aren't??
I have been involved with this breed on different levels for many years--I may have joined this board recently but I wouldn't list being a member of a board in my resume either!! LOL!!

I did not say anything would be easy I say the dog is worth the effort.

Rich

[jlaack]

I know of 2 Rottweilers that have been re-homed in the last 3 months that are doing wonderfully ---both were considered dangerous by their previous inexperienced owners.

I completely understand as I have helped a similar dog in my past eventhough I was a complete novice and it wasn't even my dog nor become my dog. I found a fantastic trainer and worked really hard. I have two rescues both of which needed fine tuning though weren't straight out aggressive. SO, I hear you loud and clear where you are coming from. I think a lot of concern on this particular post is that the OP has really not been a responsible dog owner. And for this reason the thought the OP placing this dog with his inexperience and complete lack of common sense is a huge concern. The OP has put people's safety at risk through poor management of the dog without regards to them (strangers and friends) so would the OP really be able to find a good home for the dog where the dog isn't a liability?

And as the others have posted while there are good homes for dogs like this it is hard enough to place the angel dogs let alone the dogs with problems. Personally I would take on a project dog, possibly, as long as I was in a position to ensure the dog did would not hurt anyone let alone become a statistic. But reality, I have my hands full with properly caring for my two Rottweilers now, there simply isn't room for one with issues.

[Shane]

Originally Posted by Ckimba99

I've made phone calls to the best trainer in Florida, who has over 50 years of experience, and has trained over 40,000 Rottweilers, German Shephards and Dobermans. I am awating his call, and will most likely be taking him down to his school to make an assessment.

Maybe I misunderstood, but this person is claiming to have trained over 40K dogs and gave you a phone assessment that the dog was genetically faulty?

Doing math, they'd have to train 800 dogs every year for each of those 50 years to reach that number.

That's also over half of the total number of GSDs, Rottweilers, and Dobermans registered with the AKC in 2006.

I'd be sprinting away from any trainer making those claims.

AKC Dog Registration Statistics

[jlaack]

Maybe I misunderstood, but this person is claiming to have trained over 40K dogs and gave you a phone assessment that the dog was genetically faulty?

I must have missed this but I agree with Shane this number must be inflated. Not to mention while the fault might be genetics I'm sure the owner had a contribution by doing nothing to deal with the dogs behaviors for months.

[Calin]

Originally Posted by Ckimba99

Thing is, once we develop a specific plan, and a regimine for my dog, on how to correct his behavior - How do I work with him on allowing people in my home, and not barking, and intimidating them?

You ask your trainer.

So, moving on from my mistakes, let's start using this forum how it should be used, and let's begin formulating a plan. Tomorrow I will present the plan along with Mr. Gaileys thoughts, and work from there.

Please. I know your game. You want US to formulate a plan for you over the Internet so you can try ONCE AGAIN to 'do it yourself' and save yourself some bucks.

ASK YOUR TRAINER ABOUT FORMULATING A PLAN. WE CANNOT PROPERLY EVALUATE THIS PROBLEM ONLINE. IT WOULD BE DANGEROUS FOR US TO DO SO. QUIT TRYING TO AVOID DOING WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE. SEE A TRAINER! WORK WITH A TRAINER! ASK YOUR TRAINER!

Dipper, if that's the way you feel, why don't YOU take the dog?

Seriously, I have no problem with this dog being re homed into an EXPERIENCED household. My only concern is I totally lack confidence in the OP's ability to pick out an experienced household to place him in. I think if the OP tried to rehome this dog, it would end up in 'any old household' and possibly really hurt someone.

The OP has shown some of the worst judgment I have ever personally witnessed when it comes to dog ownership. I do not think this poor judgment would disappear should he try to rehome his dog.

[ftsinc1]

Originally Posted by alice's mommy

Explain to me why you're considering putting him down, when you haven't done the work needed to get him/YOU trained properly!?! You were posting about this SIX MONTHS AGO and still haven't actually done more than TALK to a trainer?! May I inquire as to why?

Thank You, I Like That !

[Hainland]

I have spent some time on the phone with Ckimba99. I have repeatedly told him to seek profesional help. He seems to be trying to take care of this issue and I hope some advice I have offered has helped. He has reached a new obstacle and again seeked help. He has made an appointment with Bob, whom dispite some of you doubt, I know from experience is more educated and experienced with dogs than most all of you on this forum. No argument. Maybe the numbers are misquoted from Ckimba99. Regardless, my advice to Ckimba remains, "do not look for help from online forums or the likes of Petsmart dog trainers". "Go to a reputable trainer, get an evaluation at the very least and do you best." To my knowledge, he has avoided serious reactions from this dog. I advised neutering Roscoe, as a start.
At the very least, Ckimba99 is seeking help. These forums are a good source of information, but not good for trying to determine a problem without seeing it first hand. For the record, I told Ckimba99 that it is unfair for me to evaluate over the phone. I believe this dog is doing it's best to communicate before it reacts, most people are not educated in reading dogs, thus the problem handling most of them.

[Calin]

Originally Posted by Hainland

I have spent some time on the phone with Ckimba99. I have repeatedly told him to seek profesional help.

Join the club. We've been telling him the same for the past year.

[poohbearsmom]

Originally Posted by dipper

Yeah so give up---ANYONE WHO HAS A PROBLEM DOG DON'T BOTHER SEEKING HELP BECAUSE MOST PEOPLE ARE TO BUSY TO HELP YOU!!
Just do the right thing and put your dog down--don't try---don't bother anyone because in this great big country, a few people here on this board just KNOW that MOST people who could help you can't or won't because, after all, they are just to busy and have lives of their own.
You guys must know MOST of the qualified trainers out there to speak for them so---AND--no one here knows just WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THIS DOG!! JEEZ!!

Rich

Are you willing to take in a problem dog, dipper?

Thank you Amanda for chiming in. I really hope that Ckimba follows through this time.

[observer]

As I pointed out, ckimba was already thinking of PTS this dog when he started the thread. We did NOT put that idea in his head. If the dog can be rehomed, ckimba needs help, perhaps from this trainer, in finding the proper home. As was said by someone else earlier, I would not trust his judgment alone in finding the proper placement.

dipper, yes I am cynical from reading the posts for a few years from people who have failed their dogs and come here looking for help, and people chime in saying, oh, just find him a new home with someone who can handle him. It's nice to think otherwise, but such homes are not as prevalent as we wish they were. If ckimba can't handle the dog's training, I hope that with help someone can be found who can.

[makjamz]

Ckimba99 needs to spend less time fielding questions over the phone, and forums on "how/what to do?" - at this late date, to fix the problems, JUST HEED the advice given prior & now, when this surfaced over 6 months ago.

What is going on here is a lot of chatter from Ckimba99 - and nothing concrete physically done with a professional behaviorist/trainer to TRAIN in the "flesh" himself on how to work a dog, and his dog (on how to fix the behavior) and them as a team.

Shopping about for advice and ignoring it has damaged your dog Ckimba99. It could potentially result in a headlining disaster which premotes BLS, and is so sad for the responsible owners of this breed.

JUST DO IT. Nothing else I need to say - as it has been said in so many good ways by other kind and caring folks on here.

Mary-Ann

[anita]

It seems to me your tenseness in the situation was felt by the dog....and he behaved exactly as you expected him to. This dog needs socialization and leadership, and if his aggression isn't due to genetics I think he has a chance. Please give him this chance by working with him and a behaviorist. Otherwise rehome him

[Ckimba99]

Hey Everyone,



Good morning. I have very upsetting news, but yesterday was Rosco's last day on this earth. It was a great day though for him. We went on his favorite 2 miles walk on the bike path behind my condo, where there were cows, and all sorts of fun smells. And afterwards, we went over to Bob Gaileys K9 Training Ranch for the assessment, where he got to meet some new wildlfe he had never seen.

Bob made the assessment right off the bat. I began telling Bob Rosco's history, from birth till now. Every incident. Poor breeding, where I got him, from who, what happened when I had gotten Rosco, specific incidents at home, with family, other people outside, food aggression, and the latest incident with my friend, in my home as well. And, like I said, right away, he made the diagnosis. He began with telling me that first, and foremost, Rosco was poorly breeded, and has a genetic flaw. Which I can honeslty say, as hard as it is to admit, that's 100% true.

Let me give everyone some background information here.

The night I brought Rosco home from the airport, took him out of the crate in my living room, he was VERY shy of me, and skiddish. Not to the point where you would think he was terribly abused, but just to where he was very scared of other people, and you could tell this. Now, that's not a normal puppy behavior, and I knew this. Placed a call to my breeder, told him the situation, said it was because of vaccinations they had given him before the flight, or MAYBE it was even something on the plane, who knows. In any case, about a month later, I took him to my mothers home down South, where we had our family over. Everyone wanted to pet Rosco, of course because he was so adorable as a puppy, and when people tried to pet him, he immediately began squeeling like a pig, and urinating. His eyes would get very big, an strained, and he was just simply terrifed. Right at that moment, I knew there was an issue with my little boy. Something wasn't right, both chemically, and from where he came from.

In any case, after that, my diagnosis was also that he definitely needed socialization. So, the next 4 months, until he had his parvo shots. I took him to PetSmart, in the baby basket, and walked around the store for a good 1 every other day of the week. So people could pet him, and touch him, etc.

It came to a point to where when he was old enough to go to the dog park, he would be great. He would play wonderfully with dogs, let people touch him and pet him, sniff other people, it was a completely different dog then he was a few days ago. Although, I will add, he was still very scared and distrustful of others. When someone wanted to pet him, he would sort of shy away with his head, but would let the people do so.

So, after my friend died, around the time Rosco was 9 months, I just became laxidasical about continuing the socialization, and training. I have no friends here where I live, so noone ever came over, and for the next 5 months after that up to this point, is where he just grew into an overprotective animal, fearful and distrustful to everyone, and everything.

I blame myself partially, and I blame my breeder. That's it.

What it came down to was, sure, Bob gave me a wonderful plan, gave me a WONDERFUL discount on his boarding program, but... Sure, even if I were to take that time, spend that money, and work with my little guy to improvement... He just would never be a trustful dog. Around me, or around anyone else. And that is just a liability waiting to happen, a "statistic" if you will. And I, as a responsible pet owner, a responsible Rottweiler owner a responsible HUMAN, cannot put my dog, or other people in a potentially harmful situation.

Sure, I was considering calling Amanda, or even Bob and asking if they knew anyone who would enjoy him, with the experience to work with his situation, etc. But in reality, this dog wouldn't accept any other human being except for myself. Period. He was just wired wrong. That's it.

So, I will end it like that. Yesterday was the toughest day I've ever had, and putting my loved one down was the hardest thing I have ever done in my life. The good thing though, is that I had him heavily sedated before the injection, so he was snorring and sleeping when he was injected with the anestesia to pass away.

So, that's it. I've learned two very big lessons, amongst others. 1, I am far too young for a dog, let a lone a Rottweiler. 2, next time, when considering purchasing such a special breed, I need to do more research.



Thank you all, for all the advice. I wish you all well with your animals, and I really hope that one day, someone will run across with similar issues, and read my posts - So they possibly can prevent losing there loved ones.



Rest in Peace Rosco...I will always love you forever. 14 Months.

[poohbearsmom]

Originally Posted by Ckimba99

Hey Everyone,



Good morning. I have very upsetting news, but yesterday was Rosco's last day on this earth. It was a great day though for him. We went on his favorite 2 miles walk on the bike path behind my condo, where there were cows, and all sorts of fun smells. And afterwards, we went over to Bob Gaileys K9 Training Ranch for the assessment, where he got to meet some new wildlfe he had never seen.

Bob made the assessment right off the bat. I began telling Bob Rosco's history, from birth till now. Every incident. Poor breeding, where I got him, from who, what happened when I had gotten Rosco, specific incidents at home, with family, other people outside, food aggression, and the latest incident with my friend, in my home as well. And, like I said, right away, he made the diagnosis. He began with telling me that first, and foremost, Rosco was poorly breeded, and has a genetic flaw. Which I can honeslty say, as hard as it is to admit, that's 100% true.

Let me give everyone some background information here.

The night I brought Rosco home from the airport, took him out of the crate in my living room, he was VERY shy of me, and skiddish. Not to the point where you would think he was terribly abused, but just to where he was very scared of other people, and you could tell this. Now, that's not a normal puppy behavior, and I knew this. Placed a call to my breeder, told him the situation, said it was because of vaccinations they had given him before the flight, or MAYBE it was even something on the plane, who knows. In any case, about a month later, I took him to my mothers home down South, where we had our family over. Everyone wanted to pet Rosco, of course because he was so adorable as a puppy, and when people tried to pet him, he immediately began squeeling like a pig, and urinating. His eyes would get very big, an strained, and he was just simply terrifed. Right at that moment, I knew there was an issue with my little boy. Something wasn't right, both chemically, and from where he came from.

In any case, after that, my diagnosis was also that he definitely needed socialization. So, the next 4 months, until he had his parvo shots. I took him to PetSmart, in the baby basket, and walked around the store for a good 1 every other day of the week. So people could pet him, and touch him, etc.

It came to a point to where when he was old enough to go to the dog park, he would be great. He would play wonderfully with dogs, let people touch him and pet him, sniff other people, it was a completely different dog then he was a few days ago. Although, I will add, he was still very scared and distrustful of others. When someone wanted to pet him, he would sort of shy away with his head, but would let the people do so.

So, after my friend died, around the time Rosco was 9 months, I just became laxidasical about continuing the socialization, and training. I have no friends here where I live, so noone ever came over, and for the next 5 months after that up to this point, is where he just grew into an overprotective animal, fearful and distrustful to everyone, and everything.

I blame myself partially, and I blame my breeder. That's it.

What it came down to was, sure, Bob gave me a wonderful plan, gave me a WONDERFUL discount on his boarding program, but... Sure, even if I were to take that time, spend that money, and work with my little guy to improvement... He just would never be a trustful dog. Around me, or around anyone else. And that is just a liability waiting to happen, a "statistic" if you will. And I, as a responsible pet owner, a responsible Rottweiler owner a responsible HUMAN, cannot put my dog, or other people in a potentially harmful situation.

Sure, I was considering calling Amanda, or even Bob and asking if they knew anyone who would enjoy him, with the experience to work with his situation, etc. But in reality, this dog wouldn't accept any other human being except for myself. Period. He was just wired wrong. That's it.

So, I will end it like that. Yesterday was the toughest day I've ever had, and putting my loved one down was the hardest thing I have ever done in my life. The good thing though, is that I had him heavily sedated before the injection, so he was snorring and sleeping when he was injected with the anestesia to pass away.

So, that's it. I've learned two very big lessons, amongst others. 1, I am far too young for a dog, let a lone a Rottweiler. 2, next time, when considering purchasing such a special breed, I need to do more research.



Thank you all, for all the advice. I wish you all well with your animals, and I really hope that one day, someone will run across with similar issues, and read my posts - So they possibly can prevent losing there loved ones.



Rest in Peace Rosco...I will always love you forever. 14 Months.

Ckimba,

It takes a very strong person to do the right thing. I'm very sorry for your loss, but know that you did right - by yourself and by Rosco.

Godspeed Rosco, and hearffelt sympathies to you Ckimba.

I'm so very sorry.

[jazzking1971]

deleted response. please don't get another dog