My new boy attacked a little dog (long)

[Laura]

Let me give you some background on my boy. He is 5 years old intact around 120 lbs. He was a confirmation dog until he got too big for the show ring. He was on a farm and left to his own accord. He was returned to his breeder for about 2 years and that's where I got him from. I've had him for close to 3 weeks. She told be that he didn't like little yappy dogs.

The incident happened when I went to take him for a swim at a beach where no people usually go. I was on an embankment looking for other dogs. I saw a man with a big dog about 15 feet from me. I waited for him to pass but he stopped and waved me to go first.

I didn't know that he wasn't going to wait and he started to walk toward me. Low and behold there was 2 men with 2 doxies right behind him coming out of the weeds. One was yapping away at my dog. I held Dhargo back but he went like a bullet shot out of a gun. Of course I was on the floor. The man thank God pulled them apart. The poor little thing was traumatized for about 20 seconds then popped up and started to walk away with a little prance like nothing happened. The only blood I saw was when my boy got bit on the nose.

I was telling the guy we have to go to the Vet but he walked away and said no and looked at me like he was going to kill me. I don't blame him, I wanted to kill me. I hope that poor thing didn't have internal injuries.

Dhargo is wonderful in the house and listens to me. My problem is he doesn't listen to my outside. He walks very good on lead and I only allow him to pee where I tell him but of course that's not enough.

I want to put him in the Ob school I have attended for 3 years with my 3 1/2 year old female who has a CGC and a CD (going for my CDX), but I am afraid he will go after another dog again. I really wanted to get a CD on him and try herding. I bought a harness and I borrowed a cart. I have a lot of plans for this boy.

I have only been walking him very short distances now and watching diligently for other dogs.

How should I go about correcting this?

[rottnkidd]

Laura- If Dhargo was off-leash then that was your first mistake. You were unsure about his behavior around other dogs, and going to a public beach was risky, and the resulting attack was proof of that. I'd be sure to get him in class, and consult with the trainer(s) before hand about his 'issues'.
Use a prong collar and a good leather lead and keep a good grip on it!
Best wishes to you and Dhargo-
kathy

[Judi W]

First, I would say you need to learn to position the collar and hang on to your dog in such a fashion that he does not take you down the road regardless of his inclinations. Doing that then allows you to take him to classes where he and you can learn to work around other dogs of all kinds, and other places regardless of who or what he might encounter. If you cannot do that, then of course you should not be taking him out at all. His breeder was very remiss in not dealing with this and teaching him some leash manners, but now that falls on you. If you need to, get someone to give you a couple of private lessons in how to physically control the dog. Only after you can do that will you be in a position to extend his learning.

There is no way you can guarantee that there will not be people out with small dogs regardless of where you are if you are outside your own property. As you discovered, looking is not sufficient so you must be able to exercise physical control.

So, long story short - you must be able to control him physically before you can go further and train him. That will be your first step. Contact your obedience instructor for a referral to someone who can show you how to exert physical control.

[Laura]

Thanks for your replies. I walk him in front of my house for 1/2 of a block. But I'm not going to do that until I get a handle on this. If this doesn't work out, he will go back to the breeder. She has said she will always take him back. But I'm going to try to work at this because he stole my heart.

Rottnkidd: My first mistake was the thought of going to the beach. I did have him on a leash with a prong collar. I lost my footing in the sand. A scary lesson to learn.

[poohbearsmom]

Originally Posted by Judi W

First, I would say you need to learn to position the collar and hang on to your dog in such a fashion that he does not take you down the road regardless of his inclinations. Doing that then allows you to take him to classes where he and you can learn to work around other dogs of all kinds, and other places regardless of who or what he might encounter. If you cannot do that, then of course you should not be taking him out at all. His breeder was very remiss in not dealing with this and teaching him some leash manners, but now that falls on you. If you need to, get someone to give you a couple of private lessons in how to physically control the dog. Only after you can do that will you be in a position to extend his learning.

There is no way you can guarantee that there will not be people out with small dogs regardless of where you are if you are outside your own property. As you discovered, looking is not sufficient so you must be able to exercise physical control.

So, long story short - you must be able to control him physically before you can go further and train him. That will be your first step. Contact your obedience instructor for a referral to someone who can show you how to exert physical control.

In addition to Judi's sage advice. Even if Dhargo was good on leash with his former owner, does not mean that he'll automatically respect you as his new leader. So, any training that he received prior to you owning him, will need to be 'transferred' to you. Please enroll him in a class with a QUALIFIED instructor as soon as possible.

A side note.. the higher the collar is on his neck, and the shorter the lead he's allowed to have, the more control you'll have over him.

When you do contact a trainer that you feel can help you, ask him/her about various training devices, like a prong collar, and how to use it properly, and safely.

Please heed Judi's advice, welcome to the forums.

[Laura]

Originally Posted by poohbearsmom

In addition to Judi's sage advice. Even if Dhargo was good on leash with his former owner, does not mean that he'll automatically respect you as his new leader. So, any training that he received prior to you owning him, will need to be 'transferred' to you. Please enroll him in a class with a QUALIFIED instructor as soon as possible.

A side note.. the higher the collar is on his neck, and the shorter the lead he's allowed to have, the more control you'll have over him.

When you do contact a trainer that you feel can help you, ask him/her about various training devices, like a prong collar, and how to use it properly, and safely.

Please heed Judi's advice, welcome to the forums.

I have contacted a shutzhund instructor who unfortunatley is in PA and I'm in S.I. New York. He feels that I have to build a trust first and give corrections but not too harsh. Also I shouldn't put him in a situation where I have to give a harsh correction at this point in our relationship. I might take a trip to have a private lesson with him.
I desperately want to put him classes, I told my instuctor I was afraid to bring him to classes because he might go after another dog. I'll talk to her again. Should I take him to classes with a muzzle on?

Also he was barking at a baby who was playing in the other yard, could there be an association with little dogs and babies. Or am I just being paranoid?

Now that you mentioned about holding the prong high on the neck that was the problem with the beach incident. I wasn't holding the prong, just the leash, and he had leeway to bolt.

Thanks for the welcome but I've been a member for awhile . I put my 2 cents in occassionally, but I'm not that memorable or chatty

[Judi W]

You can attend classes "if" you can control him physically. Muzzle or not, no one wants their dog terrorized. The muzzle only means he can't bite it doesn't mean he can't scare the heck out of everyone if you can't hang on to him.

Actually, I believe I can use greater control with a slip collar than a pinch for that type of control. The pinch is excellent for corrections as it adds authority where it is somewhat lacking, but with a slip collar, I can put it up behind the ears and if called for, put enough tension on it that the dog is on tippy toes with its front feet. It is not going anywhere!

Yes, the trainer is correct that for the actual sophisticated training to get going, you need a relationship, but it must be a relationship where the dog does not have the idea that it is in control of the situation by simply using brute force.

[Laura]

Originally Posted by Judi W

Yes, the trainer is correct that for the actual sophisticated training to get going, you need a relationship, but it must be a relationship where the dog does not have the idea that it is in control of the situation by simply using brute force.

If I'm getting this right that's why obedience trainging is very important.

[Judi W]

Yes, of course. But you need to be able to hold him first before any training can take place. If you arrive at training and the dog can drag you wherever he wants, what he would be learning from that is not something you want imprinted in his brain.

[Laura]

Originally Posted by Judi W

Yes, of course. But you need to be able to hold him first before any training can take place. If you arrive at training and the dog can drag you wherever he wants, what he would be learning from that is not something you want imprinted in his brain.

Thanks, it's getting a lot clearer for me now.

[Judi W]

Good. I'm glad you understand what I am getting at. If the dog learns (and he will learn quickly) that all he has do to is give a lunge and he can go wherever he wants dragging you along, then he will believe - and rightly so - that whether to be polite with you is entirely his option. Whilst you will be training with motivation, you also want him to believe that respecting you and the leash is not optional.

[probe1957]

As the former owner of a VERY dog aggressive APBT, I feel your pain. That being said, there are ways to deal with it. Consulting with your trainer is an excellent start.

[Therottweilerlady]

If he starts pulling on you, make sure you keep your arms close to your body while you are controlling him. If he gets your arms straight out as I have seen many dogs do, you have no leverage against his strength when he lunges. I have also stopped a dog from attacking another animal by grabbing their hind leg by the loose skin where it joins the hip. He was standing in front of me when this happened. This dog was not on a leash and was going after a cat that had gotten in our fenced yard.
The Rottweiler Lady
Buck
Sheba
Brandy
Cody (at the Rainbow Bridge)
Elsa (at the Rainbow Bridge)

[Judi W]

Yes, grabbing the flank especially if you have fingernails, can really make a dog stop and scream - however, do not do this to a dog you don't know well, or you might find one turn around and make you scream.

Basically, try not to recommend anything that might get a novice who cannot read or understand dogs well chewed up...............

[HUGGYBEAR]

Originally Posted by rottnkidd

Use a prong collar and a good leather lead and keep a good grip on it!
kathy

My sentiments exactly.............with the correct obedience training your dog should be able to ignore another dog while executing a heel, downstay, sitstay.....etc.
I understand what you are going through, a couple of days ago I was walking sasha and shyne and this medium sized dog comes barreling out of the neighbors garage barking their head off......sasha was fine, but shyne (my male) isn't one to back down, so he rears up on his hind legs and gives his warning bark, stops the dog in it's tracks and then the owners are looking at me like im in the wrong while my dogs are leashed and theirs is loose......jerks.