Need your expertise

[BAM130]

Hello all...I'm Mandy and this is my first time posting, as well as my first time to the boards...so glad I found you all. Everyone seems to be very knowledgable, and hopefully, you can help us out. We rescued a 2 yr. old, unaltered male rottie last Wednesday. My husband and I had been doing research on the breed, and decided we'd love to have one. We already had a 2 yr. old male border collie ( neutered ) and an indoor male cat. We found Cyrus ( the rottie) at the pound, and waited until he was available for adoption. We spent about an hour with him at the pound before we took him home, just to observe his behavior with us and overall temperment before taking him home. They had no history on him at all - he was picked up running the streets. He dis already know how to sit, shake, and stay - someone had spent some time with him. He seemed stressed, but overall, a big sweetheart. Well, we brought him home, and the 2 dogs seemed to get along fine...have had a few minor tiffs, but that's to be expected. However, the cat was another issue. Cyrus had obviously never been around one, and was very interested, much to the cat's dismay. Our other dog, Loki, had always been relatively uninterested in our cat. So, needless to say, the cat was freaked out. We separated Cyrus and the cat while we were gone, and let them have supervised visits while we were home. Well, Sunday we went out of town for the day, and had a friend come let the dogs for us. We got home to find the spare bedroom door (where the cat was) open and our cat dead. He hadn't been mangled at all. We're assuming Cyrus just has that prey drive, chased the cat, and must have snapped his neck once he got ahold of him. Cyrus had never shown any aggression with the cat - just mostly curiousity. But now everyone I tell the story to tells me to get rid of the dog asap, and that he might do the same thing to our other dog, Loki, if ever they get into a fight while we're not home. Does that "prey drive" ever include other dogs?? Cyrus isn't really aggressive with Loki - he does bare his teeth occasionally when Loki tries to initiate play, and they have had some minor tiffs the last few days. Cyrus is quite a bit larger than Loki, and I guess I'm just really concerned. He has shown some dominant traits, such as stealing Loki's toys away from him, and not letting Loki outside before him, and of course the humping. He does have an appointment to get neutered next Friday, which I've heard can help with some aggression. I just don't want to get rid of him, but I don't want his second chance to be ruined by him hurting or killing our Loki either. I guess I just need some advice. Thanks for anything you can do to help!! ~Mandy~

[Judi W]

Since you have two males of the same age, there is a good chance of them not getting along at some point. I would never leave them alone together no matter how much you think they are compatible at this time. Things can erupt in a hurry. It is also not a good idea to leave an unknown dog loose and unattended anyway. He should be safely crated when no one is there to supervise. An issue between the two dogs would be unrelated to the cat/dog issue. It would be related to competition between same sex same age. As the dogs mature they are often less likely to share the pack position.

[theoriginalflyingl]

I am no expert and others may disagree, but here's what I think. No, you should not get rid of him, but you should definatly not get any more cats. Also, you should crate Cyrus when you are not home supervising him. Never allow the 2 dogs to be alone together unsupervised. These 'tiffs' you are describing though, what all is involved? Do you as the alpha, step in and tell them to 'knock it off'? Do you allow Cyrus to push Loki around? I think you should also invest in some good training classes. You need to build a relationship of trust and respect with him. Neutering won't help with aggression though, so don't count on it to solve anything (though still get it done!).

[BAM130]

The tiffs usually involve loud growling/snarling, and the two dogs snapping and trying to place front paws around the other dog. Brian (my husband) and I definitely do not allow this type of behavior, and step in to break them up by brief loud scolding, which has worked so far. We originally tried placing the dogs in seperate rooms while we were not home, but Cyrus (the new rottie) tore half of the bedroom door off to try to get to Loki. They cried and barked at eachother from across the house, which I'm sure provoked Cyrus to tear the door apart. Then we broke out the good ol' crate, and started putting him in there while we weren't home. He DID NOT want to go in, and once we finally got him into the crate he howled miserably the ENTIRE time we were gone. My husband left for about an half hour one day, and got home to hear the dog still howling from outside before he even pulled in the driveway!! So I'm truly at a loss for what to do. Should I keep him in the crate even though he's absolutely miserable?

[Judi W]

better a dog howling in the crate than torn up BC and Rottweiler. Although you might say you don't allow...... when you are not there, it doesn't matter what you don't allow when you are there. I think you have given him way too much freedom for a dog you don't even know and you must realize that to him, you are not that much in charge - he doesn't know you or the household rules either. Anyone taking in an adult unknown dog should do so with the understanding that it takes considerable time to develoop the relationship as well as to know what is going on. You are still in the honeymoon period and as he gains confidence you will see still more changes.

I will not say whether you should or should not keep the dog, as I would not have adopted out a same sex, same age dog in the first place. If you keep him you should do so with the understanding that you might find in the future that the dogs will need to live separated from one another. Regardless, do not leave him uncrated and unattended.

[BAM130]

True...and we probably have given him a little too much freedom, being that we don't know anything about him. I guess it's easy to assume that things will be fine until something bad does happen. And I definitely have seen some changes in his behavior over the last few days, and not necessarily ones for the better. We definitely have some issues that need to be worked on with him. Thank you for the quick responses and advice. I really appreciate it.

[brunie's mom]

Did you get any background information on the Rottie when you adopted him? What was the reason that he was given up?

He may have never been in a house before...let alone a crate.!!!!! He may also have been given up (dumped) for seperation anxiety. Do a search here...there is help for this problem.

If he has never been crate trained...locking him up in a crate and expecting him to be quiet and happy...may not happen. You must train him to accept the crate. Start by feeding all of his meals in the crate. Show him a treat...throw it into the back of the crate....give him a command such as "crate" or "bed" or "kennel up" and close the crate door. Keep him in there till he settles down. When he is quiet..let him out. Start by keeping him in for short amounts of time.
The crate should be a good place for him.

The neutering may help with the spats taking place between the two dogs....but it may not?? Having two same sex, same age dogs is not easy and not recommended.
I would not be leaving the dogs alone together. After the neuter, get signed up for some classes and see if you can make it work with the two....if things are still going rough...I would return him to the shelter.
If you ever plan on adopting again...get a female dog.

Gina

[Judi W]

He was a stray so there is no information although he shows clearly he had some training and attention

[Platzz]

All dogs go through a "Honeymoon" period when you 1st introduce them into the home. Then thier personnality arrives.

As said don't leave the boys alone together.

They are going to work out thier statous no matter how hard to try to letthem live separate lives together. So be ready for it. You may even want to keep a tab on thier collars if youshould have to referee.

[AMoJoLover]

and Never, by any means, put them in their crate as punishment!!!!!
This will make them hate it even more!!

[Delminico]

Killing cats is prey drive. Dogs won't attack others dogs becuz they go after smaller non-dog animals. My prior Rottweilers have unfortunately caught ground hogs, rats, birds and squirrels. Yes, cats too. Killed them with a big single shake. Same dogs loved people and other dogs they knew well.

You'll need to invest serious time training this unknown Rottweiler. Neuter him for sure. Keep him on a prong collar and lead outside your house on walks outside a fenced area. Don't let your new dog and other dog interact alone at all. Keep the Rottweiler on a prong collar and lead around your other dog. Make sure you understand how to use one. Get a good trainer to show you how to use it. It will ****not**** hurt the dog. It will give you much better control of a big unknown dog. Start too basic obedience. Sit, stay, down, come, heel, wait. Use treats to reward at first then taper off and go to verbal praise and pets or a favorite toy. First you need a relationship with this new dog. Then you work on the relationship of the 2 dogs. Work now pays off later.

And no more cats for this dog. Now that he's done one in, he'll do the same with others. It's nature not aberrant behavior. So sorry for the poor cat though.

[jamiesonyx]

I just bought a 4 month old Rottweiler and I had an existing ???? zu (not sure on the spelling of the breed). The ???? zu (Sage) is only 6 months old. Both girls. I was a little nervous at first but it turns out they get a long pretty well. Onyx (my Rott) is very playful and sometimes a little rough with the little dog. But the little dog lets her know right away when it is too much. I can tell in her bark that she has had enough and so can Onyx. So she just stops playing for a few seconds and puts her head down like she did something wrong. Then after a few seconds she goes right back in and they go at it again. It is actually pretty entertaining most of the time.
I am no expert and I would never leave my two dogs home alone (uncrated) but I think you should give it some time. The Rottweiler will come around. If he knows you do not like it, he will stop sooner or later. He just wants to please you.

[RottsNScotts]

[quote=BAM130]True...and we probably have given him a little too much freedom, being that we don't know anything about him. QUOTE]

Being a new member to this forum, this is a common thread I am seeing that just drives me nuts! I am seeing a LOT - MOST, in fact - of people adopting a new older Rottie - and even younger Rotties - that just bestow every freedom on their new unknown dog.

How about making these new dogs EARN their priviledges???

They are confined unless being watched until they prove they can be trusted to move around the house without error for short periods at first, gradually increasing the length of time. They do not interact with kids, cats or other dogs unless on leash and closely monitored until they prove trustworthy in these situations. Etc. And don't be in such a rush to trust them to know/do the right thing!

[Sharon Marples]

Originally Posted by jamiesonyx

I am no expert and I would never leave my two dogs home alone (uncrated) but I think you should give it some time. The Rottweiler will come around. If he knows you do not like it, he will stop sooner or later. He just wants to please you.

Excuse me???

This is NOT the approach to take! You do not just figure that the Rottweiler will "come around." That is probably the most likely thing NOT to happen.

This dog needs training and strict observation when with the BC. He is NOT going to stop this behavior just because "he wants to please you." Nope, nada, not gonna happen.

Please do not follow this advice, follow what was told to you by Judi and the others, training and observation and do not ever leave the dogs alone together.

[jamiesonyx]

Wow. Some of you people are just weird. Don't be so opinionated about every singe subject. Raising dogs are similar to raising children. Some things work better for some dogs and some things work better for others. It sounds like you need some anger management. I would really hate to be your dog.