Rottweilers & Small Dog Aggression

[Zephyr]

Hi all,

Zev is my 2nd Rottie, and she's from a local shelter. She's been a truly wonderful dog with only very minor forays into mischief. Nothing serious. Recently, I introduced her to my best friend's male Lab, who is the exact same size as Zev. Zev is still intact until next Thursday when she's set to be spayed. She and Jackson, the Lab, get along like peas and carrots. It was love at first sniff. They play like maniacs, swim together, chase, mock fight, nip, run, pirouette and have figured out who's the boss and who's not [Zev is the dominant dog, Jackson the submissive one].
We're thrilled they get along because our families are going on vacation with the dogs this summer and we hoped they'd get on well.

However....I've noted that Zev has a really distinct dislike of small dogs. Not just *some* small dogs, ALL small dogs. She actually growls and wants to become fierce and bitey. This is shocking, considering her otherwise docile and calm demeanor. The other day at the vet's, a man with a tiny Miniature Pincher was there. Zev took one look at the dog, a male and went into fierce growly mode. We immediately corrected with a firm "NO" and "DOWN" but she was going nuts to get that dog. The only other times I've seen that is for small dogs. She really loves people and kids, but not small dogs. She's good in obedience class, but the dogs are all her size or just slightly smaller. It's the tiny ones she's dislikes.

Is this a Rottie trait or a Zev thing? Is there any safe manner to acclimate her to small dogs or should I just chalk it up to Rottie behavior? Anyone else have this issue? All suggestions would be much appreciated.

One more thing - she's come along well with her basic obedience, as when I got her, she was clueless to even the basics. She's now doing HEEL, SIT, DOWN, STAY [not that well yet], DOWN and COME, and DROP IT very well. She's still got 7 more classes to go to, and I'm working with her every day [but not so much she's bored].

[Snooze]

I also have a rescue who is a wonderful guy - very obedient, loves everyone - execept small dogs and bicycles. I think maybe it has something to do with prey instinct?

[Hope]

This is most certainly not a "rotti thing" and I wouldn't personally chalk it up to prey drive either.

I would imagine it has to do with poor socialization at an early age. People think sometimes that if you socialize with dogs that the dog will be fine down the line, it takes socialization with ALL types of dogs as well as ALL types of people to get a dog truly socialized so that things don't shake the dog's nerves.

My dog is aggressive if in very close contact will large intact males, but he is NEVER allowed to be placed in such situations. No matter what, he is EXPECTED to be tolerant. I don't expect him to like everyone and every dog, but he has no place to lack tolerance and there is a huge difference.

There are plenty of well socialized male and female rottweilers that get on with everyone and everything. Please don't think that dog aggression is a tolerable part of owning a rottweiler. The aggression shown by your dog towards that small pincher could have really traumatized both the owner and the dog, and it needs immediate attention (also indicates you do not have control of your dog yet)

I would suggest taking your dog to OB in a more private form as well as the larger classes. I know that when dog aggression started to spring up with my boy, I immediately took him in for personal one-on-one attention, and we worked with the dogs that were kenneled at the facility, small and big, the effect was rather quick with just a little reinforcement in public.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that you have not been doing everything right, trust me, I know how it feels to try so hard and only for everything to still not go the way intended. My dog was well socialized as a pup, but even still has a few odd habits that you would not expect after all of his training and socialization. The key is to nip it in the bud and to know that you are responsible for the dog, and don't lull yourself into the position that it is OK for a rottweiler to be aggressive just because he/she is a rottweiler. Good luck.

[Jamie & Odin]

One problem I don't have is dog aggression. My rott lives quite happily with my three year old, male, nuetered maltese. In fact, he allows the malt to take toys, waits till the malt is done getting a drink of water before him etc.

The funniest thing is when my rott and the visiting lab get too rowdy in the house, the malt will chase them and reprimand them for what he views to be innnapropriate inside play:) Bossy little bugger.

[ILoveRotts]

None of my Rotts have a problem with little dogs.

My Rusty (who just went to the bridge) actually loved little dogs. I think he thought they were puppies. He would protect them from other dogs when we went to the dog park.

[halliebear]

My rescue Hal (3 yrs old) also dislikes small male dogs. He is great with female dogs, but he really dislikes male dogs. I'm sure his socialization (like most of the other parts of his former life) was not done properly. All I expect is tolerance, he doesn't have to like them. If people want their dog to meet mine I ask if its altered and/or female. If its not the right combo, we move on.

Amy

[BlackCat]

While I haven't had any problems with our rotts regarding the small dogs, the situation reminds me a typical problem for a lot of rotties.
Rottweiler has an excellent memory and rott's early memories from a childhood is forming its attitude model later. For example, if the pup has been intimidated in early age by German shepherd, it is quite likely that the respective archetype will be fixed in memory. An adult rott probably could be agressive to any shepherd-like dog...
If you adopted already grown-up rotty, this could be the case. If it is, it is very, very hard to alter the behaviour model of the dog.
On other hand rottweiler is a born leader - it tries to dominate in any pack - sometimes in a manner which could be described as "brute force", i.e. the dog tries to dominate the weaker subjects in a pack by showing its superiority, however - in this case you are more lucky as this could be taught during OB course. It is just dog's misperception of the rules and with a little patience and adequate facilitation (i.e. punishing and praising right) it could be fixed.

[Zephyr]

Thanks everyone for the input and suggestions.

It's true, Hope, that Zev isn't completely through her obedience training. She's in a class with only one other dog, an altered male Golden. So far, the trainer and the training have been very hands on and one and one. I'm keeping Zev in this situation because she probably needs the socialization and exposure. I do have to add that Zev is remarkably well behaved in all other situations. The dog is just solidly calm and steady, not jumpy and excited or twitchy and unnerved. She does have a high alertness that seems appropriate. I'm sure the man and his Mini Pincher weren't thrilled by her sudden growly-ness, and I wasn't either. She was corrected immediately and put into SIT and DOWN.

As for her training sessions, they last at least one 1 hr. and usually go over another 20 minutes or more. After each training session, the two dogs are allowed to socialize a bit. In the same building are many other types of dogs wandering around, including small ones that Zev remarkably will ignore while in class.

In one class, a woman with a 6 month old female Husky type puppy was there too. The puppy was flighty and fear-bitey. Zev was snapped at viciously by the puppy [while standing calmly but alertly/tail erect and wagging]. Zev's response was to remain calm but to show dominance strictly via erect posture. She did not growl back, did not attempt to snap, bite or display aggression. The puppy repeatedly barked wildly, snapped and tried to bite Zev and the other adult dog [the Golden]. Both chose to ignore the youthful aggression. Eventually the puppy stopped and became calmer. I took that as a good sign that Zev has appropriate response under less than ideal situations with other dogs.

Which is why the small dog aggression has me concerned. I will work diligently with her to teach tolerance [as she has been learning with the squirrel population around here].

Today I worked with her in the park across the street and there were many distractions including small dogs. So far, using the "Leave it" command, she's getting the idea that she can't just bolt after any dog, much less small ones. She also had to ignore other distractions while doing the Long Down, Come from a Distance and Leave It when a squirrel came into view. She was on a 30 long training lead at the time. I'd say she was getting it fine, and it's her stubborness that needs work. :) Her age is also a factor insofar as the dog wasn't given formal obedience training and at 20 months is probably experiencing maturity issues still.

As for the possibility of Zev being imprinted with a negative association - such as being "beat up on" by another dog when she was a pup, that's entirely possible. I don't know her history, but she was obviously well cared for judging by her health and condition. She's clearly well bred in terms of her very correct conformation and temperament [other than the aggression for little dogs]. I think that part of her temperament is a learned behavior - perhaps defensive. Certainly she gets on well with other dogs, including other intact females. She likes people well too and can be approached by friendly sorts - big and small.

All in all, I'd say she's a middle of the road dog in terms of dominance. She's not super submissive, but not overly dominant either. I can say that she's extremely intelligent - and I can watch her thinking things over at times. I think this means she's trainable but not such a mushy dog as to have soft or weak nerves. She isn't skittish, flighty, fearful or bitey in the least. Her stubbornness so far seems more in line with a dog who wasn't ever formally ordered by a human to do something and it's taking her some time to get over the fact that she's not her own boss anymore. Because she's so damn cute and loveable, I can work with that though. :)


Payton

[BlackCat]

Well, it seems you'll get along with her and problem will be solved. If she is kind to other ("large") dogs and even female, it looks quite promising.
Just keep on working. ;)