Young Pitbull being agressive with my Rottie!

[bwholagan]

Hello all. I have a 3 yr old Rottie(who is great) and just added a 1 and half year old Amstaff/Pit mix. Usual type deal The people were going to put him down cause he was to much trouble....
Anyway so I have had him for a few months and worked with him and he is actually a really great dog. We neutered him, he loves kids, people, even others dogs. he doesn't try and fight them, just plays. The issue I am having is that he wants to be dominant over my three year old Rottie and can't seem to get it through his head that it's not gonna happen. I have really stayed on top of it and corrected him or put him in his crate when he tries it and it has toned down, but not enough. Most of time they just play and get along great. However when I feed them or I give alot of attention to the Rottie, the Pit goes after him hard. Now my Rottie knows better then to fight so he avoids it(I am worried this is giving the Pit the signal he has a chance to be more dominant). However when provoked enough Angel(Rottie) will pin the Pit to chill him out and that rare and only happens when I don't get there first to correct the Pit. So The Pit know he is not the dominant dog and I reiterate that by feeding the Rottie first and him second and pretty much everything else I have done that has worked in the past when I had 2 Rotties. However with the Rotties this was never an issue. I really want to keep this guy but he is a handful, moreso then any Rottie I have had. I am looking for any suggestions from anybody who might have experience with this. I have a trainer that will be helping me as well but he won't be there all the time. Thanks in advance for help.

Brian

[flyballmom]

Hi Brian, I'm not an expert on dog training or behavior, but from my experience of owning a Rottie, a Pit bull and a very hard headed little terrier, and also all I've read and learned from my trainer along the way-the dogs need to work it out for themselves. Just because one dog was in the home first doesn't necessarily mean that dog will be Alpha. If that does seem to be the case though, then feeding the Alpha first, petting first, etc is the right thing to do. Even though my Rott and Pit play together and seem like best buds, they do occasionally grump at each other and get a bit rough. I put a stop to it but don't discipline. I also don't leave them alone together for long periods of time. The Pit is in one room, the Rott in another. The terrier is never left free in the house, because, well, she's a terrier. Just some thoughts.

[bwholagan]

flyballmom,

Thanks for the reply. Sounds like the situation works for you and that is what I am hoping for. If I am not there they don't fight at all. Kinda strange.

Brian

[TrishB]

It sounds like they're vying for your attention. Your Rottie has asserted himself as the Alpha by pinning the Pit. You also have to be sure that everything you do says the Rottie is Alpha to the Pit (as you've been doing).

I wouldn't recommend not chosing one as alpha over the other. Dogs need to know what the hierarchy is. If you don't seem to care - they will work it out for themselves - because they will be forced to.

Dog packs are very well aware of who is who in the pack. Your role as alpha in your pack is to assure everyone that you know who is where, beneath you. So everything you do needs to point at the Rottie (only because he's already asserted himself) as alpha over the Pit. Things like, as you've said, feeding first, petting first, choice of sleeping area, not letting the Pit be 'above' the Rottie, etc.

There may be squables, but they'll work that out - as long as you're consistent, they will be too.

Best of luck! :)

[bwholagan]

Update! Thanks for replies once again. Over the weeknd I encouraged Angel(Rottie) to stand his ground with the Pit(Petey) and they have chilled out a quite a bit. He knows he is not going to get in trouble from me for asserting himself and his position. Although I keep a real close eye on them when food is around.

I have never had a Pit before and he is actually a great dog. He's no Rottie ;) , but he is great with my son and very much wants to please everyone in the household. So he is definetly staying. :)

Brian

[halliebear]

Hi Brian
I also own a pit (mix) and a rotti. I am also very involved in pitbull rescue and relatively pitbull obsessed:D Pitbulls are great, I love them, but with their history of dog-fighting, you need to be vigilant, consistent and firm.
I agree with what flyballmom says - supervise their play, step in when it gets out of hand, do not leave them alone together, ever. Above all, like TrishB says, make sure you are the real alpha - not either one of the dogs.
Also, if you aren't already obedience training goes a long way. When I feel like my dogs are getting too heated, I get their attention and ask for a sit, or a down and then I let them go back to playing. Doing obedience with both dogs gives them some one on one time with you.
I also feed my dogs in separate rooms, its one more precaution to take. I give them treats together, but if they were to scrap over treats - neither would get one and they would go for timeouts.

People at this forum will be sick of this by now, but please check out www.pbrc.net. It is probably the best online resource ever for pit bulls, you will learn a lot. You can never know too much about the dogs you have, especially if they are pits or rottis :D Good luck and have fun with your new family member

Amy

[bwholagan]

Amy,

Thanks for advice and for the link as well. I will definetly check it out. I haven't had Petey long and he does well with obediance and really likes people and dogs. I socialize him and he is not dog aggressive at all. Although he does play rough it never turns into a fight. I think him being aggressive with Angel is that he wants to be top dog. The previous owners never trained him at all and they admitted to hitting him with a broom when he didn't listen. So for a dog that has been is a less then ideal situation before I think he really appreciates all the attention and love he gets now. Anyway thanks again. And if you can think of any pointers please feel free to send them my way. :p

Brian

[rott&pitincali]

I am brand new to this site. Actually I have been reading the threads for a while, but this is my first post. I too have a rott mix and a pit mix. The pit is the older of the two, being 10 months old, and the rott is only 14 weeks. My question is this.....

My pit has never shown an aggressive attitude at all. With that said am I ever going to have to worry about agression. It is obvious that my rott wants to be top dog. She tries to mount my pit and the pit lets her. But somewhere I read that sometimes around the age of 2 the pit will become agressive or perhaps start showing agressive behaviors. Is this true. Right now they are both big babies, and are spoiled rotten.

Also, is it normal for my dogs to be fine together however, become dog agressive in my front yard with unknown dogs. For example, my pit was outfront (always on a leash) nose to nose playing with the neighbors dog (who is never on a leash, and a menace, but that is another topic) when the pup (also on a leash) came up and the other dog started to growl. Needless to say my pit got between them and went after the other dog. I was dumbfounded. My pit plays with other dogs in the neighborhood fine. However, like I said this dog constantly runs free, and most of the dogs in the neighborhood dont like her. One has even gotten into a fight with her. I think perhaps it is just that dog.

Sorry this is so long. And sorry again if this isn't the correct way to post it (as a reply, which it isn't)

Love to everyone in puppyland!!:)

[halliebear]

Hi rotnpitincali
Just becuase your pit puppy is not dog aggressive now doesn't mean this will always be so. My pit mix loved every dog she ever met til she was about 15 months old. Now 4 months later she is almost completely intolerant of female dogs. Its not bad, its just her breed. So be careful, supervise your dogs and separate them when you can't supervise them. And do obedience with them both.
As for the unleashed roaming dog, I would call animal control each and every time you see it out of its yard. If either of your dogs were to get into it, and it sounds like your pit already has, they would be blamed because of their breeds.

I would suggest you go to www.pbrc.net and check it out. It is very educational and you will find out lots to answer your questions. Since this is a rott forum though, we should probably stick to them here. ;)

Amy

[ramper02]

rottnpitincali,

Just wanted to add a little more to what the previous poster said, which I think is already implied but I'd like to say it very clearly. While many pits won't become dog aggresive til they start maturing, it is not a set rule. I've seen 4 month old puppies attack their littermates like they were grown dogs. Actually it was my own dog's brother (owned by my cousin) who at 4 months wouldn't play with my dog anymore. My dog became really fight crazy when grown, he wouldn't even tolerate females, except when they were in heat. But his brother was fight crazy from early puppyhood. I've heard this is not uncommon. I've also heard of dogs not becoming aggresive till 5 yrs old. So what am I saying? Don't leave them together alone, not now, not ever. They can be fine one minute and then just like that your pit might attack. The good news is, I've seen about 4 pit mixes and they were all great dogs. While they were very courageous, they were not aggressive and would only fight when clearly challenged or attacked. So that makes things easier. However, once they got to fighting they were as nasty as any pit I've seen. Pits are a great responsibility because of their fighting prowess. Definitely get and learn to use a breaking stick.

[rott&pitincali]

I have tried to educate myself as much as possible on both breeds. I first got the pit pup and people just looked at me funny. Then I got the rott puppy and people asked me "are you totally crazy??" But I have taken my pitx to obedience classes and she did wonderful. We are starting advanced classes here soon. If anything my rott pup is more agressive so far, and we are trying to stop that. We keep telling her no, and she has started to listen. I am almost at the 4 month mark with the little rott pup, and cant wait to start the classes with her too. I think they are both going to be wonderful dogs as their temperments seem to be really good. I haven't had them tested or anything like that, but they both seem to adapt to most all situations.

We got the rott puppy at 5 weeks, and she was the runt of the litter. She actually tried to nurse of my pitx. So I think the scuffle between the loose dog and my dog was more a I am going to protect my puppy type of thing. It was strange my pitx actaully took on a mothering roll with her. If the rott yelped the pit was right there licking her ect.

I understand there is the potential for a fight I was just wondering if it is true that at a certain age the pit might show more aggression. And I was wondering are rotts the same? Also, is there a potential for them to be more aggressive with unknown dogs?

And as for leash laws, we have called the local ASPCA, and police department. They have done nothing but patrol the neighborhood and just given verbal warning when this dog is out I dont know what else to do. The dog is beginning to show aggression to children in the neighborhood and that is really scaring me. I dont even want my daughter to go by that house anymore.

Thank you for your help, and I appologize if I shouldn't be talking about my pitx in this forum. But I saw people asking about rats and bunnies and thought heck I will ask my questions, especially since I do have a rott, too.

[Judi W]

You need to keep in mind, more than the two breeds, you have two males (neutered or not) - same sex and similar age brackets. Not a recipe for peace within the group unless one is definitely of a softer nature which it does not sound like you have.

[bwholagan]

I would keep a close eye on yours as they mature because your Rott is at a disadvantage being younger and smaller. As your Rott will most likely end up being larger then the Pit, the Pit may see the Rott as trying to take her position in the pack as she gets closer in size and challenges her. The situation with mine is getting better daily. The Rottie has clearly established his position and has no issues reminding my Pit now that he knows he will not be reprimanded but instead encouraged from me to do so. I will still keep a close on eye them but I am not worried as much because the Rottie can take care of himself. I am more worried about the Pit getting in over his head. Now when it gets a little rough between them the Pit is rolling over on his back and the Rottie will pin him for a sec and then all is good.

Brian

[halliebear]

[i]
I understand there is the potential for a fight I was just wondering if it is true that at a certain age the pit might show more aggression. And I was wondering are rotts the same? Also, is there a potential for them to be more aggressive with unknown dogs? [/b]

All dogs have the potential to be aggressive with each other, strange dogs may be more of a trigger for some. With pits though, they have been bred to ignore submission signs, so what could be "just" an ugly fight between dogs can turn very bad, very quick.

[i] Thank you for your help, and I appologize if I shouldn't be talking about my pitx in this forum. But I saw people asking about rats and bunnies and thought heck I will ask my questions, especially since I do have a rott, too. [/b]

I just put that in there because I could get carried away talking about pits, and I am here for my rotti, Hal :), since I don't know even close to as much about his breed as I know about Katie's. :D

Amy

[rott&pitincali]

Thank you all for your help.

Could it be any different if my pit is very submissive? While out on the leash she is a totally different animal. Not out of control or anything. It is more like she is talking and very vocal (sort of chattering) with other dogs. Every dog I have taken her to meet she absolutley loves (except the loose dog). She is extremely submissive in the house though. Men scare the heck out of her, she does the belly crawl to them and she leaks urine when they go to pet her. She has never ever tried to bit a human, or any other dog. But I am very careful with her. She is extremely responsive to training and I think she is the easiest dog to train so far that I have had. I am just starting basics with the rott pup though and she is also very responsive.

HallieBear, I have been to the PBRC website as well as many others. They have been very educational and I just love to read about my pit mix too. I just cant find a forum that is set up as good as this one. If you know of any can you let me know. However, I will still come here because I love the topics and most of the things people talk about I will be soon to experience with my rottie:D