Food Aggression--HELP!!!!

[nmbr1mom57]

I have read many of the posts on this site and others relating to this problem. According to what I have read the situation seems rather hopeless. My Inki is nearly 6 months old and I'm not sure how this problem actually started. We have no other dogs in the house only cats and they aren't interested in the dogs food. I feel that it may have began when we started using the crate and taking her out for food and potty breaks. Because of our hours at the time it seemed that these were the only times she was out of the crate. About a month ago when I was feeding her in the kitchen I walked behind her and bumped into her while she was eating. She growled and barked rather aggressively and went back to her eating. I was shocked but grabbed her by the scruf of the neck and told her NO firmly. I have tried several of the ideas I read here including feeding her some food by hand before giving her the bowl and picking up her food while she's eating, having her sit before giving her the bowl, etc. She has gotten somewhat better at dinner time. But now she acts up when you give her treats. I give her pig ears to help with her teething and she loves them, but she guards it with her life. She snapped at my teenager when she tried to take it from her and growled and barked at my seven year old when she has walked pasted her having no interest in the dogs treat. She is a VERY sweet pup and other than this is good natured. We have no other behavior issues with her at all. She is well-socialized, very smart and has been trained her basic commands. I hope that someone here will have some more ideas that we can try beyond a professional trainer that as a single mother I cannot afford. Thanks in advance for the help!

[myrottie_chyna]

I have heard a lot of people on here advise against highly prized treats like pig ears. I guess a lot of rotties are pretty fond of them, and get protective of them.
I never knew that my girl Chyna had a similar reaction with her food dish, until I tested her. I had my son pet her back while she was eating, and sure enough she growled. So now I have him come to help me feed her. I have him tell her to sit, then put her dish down, and tell her to wait. Then I tell him when to give her the "ok eat" command. Then I have him stand next to her and pet her back. After a few times, she quit growling.
I also take her dish away a few times while she eats.
Best thing to do is probaby give her treats like that in a crate or someplace where she wont be bothered. I wouldnt have your kids try to take things from her while she is chewing.
Have them give her treats so that she knows that they can be a source of treats also.
I'm sure lots of more experienced folks here will give you some good advice.

[nmbr1mom57]

I think that some of the best advice you can get comes from the regular Joe and not always the professional that may have their own agenda. I like the idea of having my younger one feed her more. I will definitely try this idea. We tried other chew things like those made of rawhide, but she wouldn't touch them and it was a waste of money. I will try just giving her these kinds of treats in the crate because as you say no one will bother her there. Thanks again.

[RottiMomCT]

One of my males has a mild food agression issue with his bowl. He will growl and move himself in between the bowl and the person who is petting/standing next to the bowl.

Sometimes it can be a BIG MISTAKE taking the bowl away and putting it back several times. That may make the dog think it must protect the bowl even more because it keeps getting taken away.

Give the dog it's regular meal. Take some cold cuts, really yummy treats that the dog does not ever get, but really wants (roast beef/ham/leftover steak work great!). While the dog is eating, toss a piece of food towards the bowl and then walk away. let the dog eat it, praise it, then go back and toss another piece, getting closer with each toss.

Eventually you want to be able to have the dog leave the bowl in anticipation of the treats being tossed his way. You will be able to put the stuff into his bowl while he is eating because he will think that you approaching the bowl is better than the contents of the bowl.

Giving 'high value items' such a pig ears, rawhides, etc. in the crate is a great idea. The dog can chew away without feeling that someone is going to walk by and try to take the treat.

When feeding, make the dog sit/stay while you or the kids put the bowl down. When you say "OK!!" or some other release word, he is then allowed to 'dive in' and eat. Let the kids feed the dog and have them also work him in basic obed commands (sit/stay/down, give paw) and have lots of yummy treats for the kids to give him.

Good luck.

[nmbr1mom57]

What excellent ideas. I'm really glad I became a member so that I could get some input into some of the questions I have. I like the special treat idea. I will try it also. One thing that I have found in reading up on how to handle this particular behavioral problem is that opinions are vast and varied. I think that all I can really do is try as many as possible, see which ones work or don't and just keep asking. I just want to stop the behavior before she's an adult and it's impossible to change the behavior or it becomes very dangerous. Thanks again for all your ideas!

[nmbr1mom57]

Well it turns out all is not lost for Inki. We have been trying several of the suggestions given to us here and she is improving greatly. We only give the pig ear treats occasionally and then only in the crate. That has worked wonders. We have also tried letting my younger daughter feed Inki more and that has helped too. Now Inki sees that I'm not the only source of food for her. I have also told my older daughter to stop trying to take away her food, that particular training method isn't working.

I just wanted to let everyone know persistance in training and trying different things can change the bad behavior to good.

Thanks again:D :D

[Judi W]

Originally posted by nmbr1mom57
I think that some of the best advice you can get comes from the regular Joe and not always the professional that may have their own agenda.

What agenda???? Most suggestions originated with a trainer at some point if not here on the board (which is volunteer) from a book or a class. Very few come from divine inspiration.

[BarryMcD]

> nmbr1mom57 wrote: We only give the pig ear
> treats occasionally and then only in the crate.
> That has worked wonders.

By giving the special treat in the crate, you may not be permanently solving the underlying problem, but just avoiding it.

This is an age-old technique for teaching a dog to Drop an object. It might be more helpful in actually reducing the dog's food aggression in the long run than feeding the dog a tasty treat in the crate.

1. Get two treats, one the dog has a moderate appetite for (will take it every time, but not necessariy a favorite treat), and a second one the dog absolutely LOVES (the pig ear or whatever)! Pick sizeable or long-lasting treats so the dog cannot gulp the first one down immediately.

2. Give the dog the first treat. Let the dog have it for no more than 30. Then, without trying to take away the first treat, offer the second more desireable treat. If the dog drops the first treat, reward it with the second better treat. After the dog has a clear interest in the second treat, and has probably dropped the first, slowly and nonchallantly take the first treat away.

3. If the dog does not give up treat one for treat two, then put treat two away. All doggy gets is treat one.

4. Repeat the activity daily, or even several times a day if the treats are not too greasy and filling.

5. You can also play the same game with two toys, two chewy things like rawhide and a Nylabone, etc. to reinforce the idea that giving up an object can be to the dog's benefit.

6. Goal: The dog learns to trust you and sees that if you take something away, it often gets something better in return.

7. Advanced step: Trade same for same: one pig's ear for another. Final stage: Try taking a single treat away for just a few seconds and then giving it back.


One final whacky idea: I have never tried this myself for your exact situation, but have used it successfully for hoarding with some aggression.

If your dog likes pig's ears and still behaves aggressively when eating one, by a dozen of them and throw them all over the floor around the dog. Then try gently offering him one of the others for the one he has. Repeat several times, then clean up your floor! Sounds crazy enough to work maybe? The concept here is that if the coveted object is plentiful and surrounds the dog, it will not have as much anxiety over the ONE object it has in its posssession. I did something similar with a shepherd who started hoarding toys and growling at my other dogs (dog to dog aggression rather than your case which is dog to human). I got every toy we owned, plus bought a few more, and spread them all over the living room floor and left them there all day. It seemed to work pretty well. After a week or so, we started picking up a couple toys each day until we had only a reasonable number on the floor, and the shepherd was significantly improved in his hoarding and aggressive response to oncomers.

Remember: Food aggression may come from dominance-seeking behavior, but it sometimes may be more an indication of anxiety and insecurity. Try to form an opinion about which it is with your dog, and you may develop a better understanding of what needs to be done on your part to defuse the situation.

Barry

[nmbr1mom57]

Barry you may be right. We were offering Inki the ears in the crate to give her the security that no one was going to take it from her. I am certainly willing to try your ideas as well, anything that will help to correct the behavior is appreciated.

Judy you misunderstand and I'm sorry you feel insulted. My first reply to this message came from someone that had some great ideas but felt that "more experienced" people will give me additional advice. This indicated to me that she was a regular owner like myself and not a trainer of the sort. I wanted to be sure she understood that her ideas were every bit as valuable as anyone elses. I also disagree that all training information originates from trainers at some point. People gain practical knowledge by dealing with the animals everyday. Every good idea does NOT come from a professional trainer. With the exception of this site and others professional trainers are just that professional, meaning they are paid for their experience and knowledge. Being paid for services rendered is an agenda, they aren't offering help out of the goodness of their hearts. I couldn't go to my neighborhood trainer and say "help me with my dog" and expect them to do it for nothing. But I could go to other people who own dogs, at pet food store, parks, etc., and ask for help or opinions about the dog and expect to get an answer for nothing, right, wrong or indifferent. There is nothing wrong with professional trainers AT ALL. There are many here that have offered me excellent advice about questions I have. But so have the regular, everyday owners.

I am glad to have this site to get information from, regardless of whether it's a regular Joe or a professional giving it. And again I'm sorry you felt insulted.

[Judi W]

Well, where I am, both professionals who earn their living from training and club trainers such as myself who do it as an avocation, give a tremendous amount of time and effort without charge because first and foremost our goal is for owners and dogs to be able to live together peacefully and successfully. The assumption that trainers are in it for the money is incorrect. Even those who do it as a livelihood, chose that because of the love of dogs. There are certainly easier and more lucrative ways to earn money. Most of what was recommended for problem solving has come down the grapevine, found to be of value and passed along. Often the person who was helped by the "professional" advice is the one who kindly shares their experience. Not every dog and owner even has problems. Some adjust quite nicely without intervention or outside assistance, that is correct. If however, you want or need outside assistance, please do not denigrate those who spend much effort in studying the best methods to peacefully resolve difficulties between dog and owner.

The study of behavior has a long history from Phaffenburger to Scott and Fuller, Karen Pryor and Susan Clothier and many dedicated people from whom we learn new ideas and techniques. Barry's idea of flooding is not new, but a time-honored technique that is often successful. We all read, attend seminars, share and learn because we care about the dog and its relationship to its family and society. Many of my "average joe" students have enjoyed training to the point where they apprentice and end up teaching and instructing. Do they then become something other than an "average joe"? Of course not. They become an informed and educated average joe with more tricks in their bag to share with others.

As far as the food issue, the archives will show most of what you read. Personally I do not advocate taking the bowl away and returning it as I believe that heightens the dog's anxiety and simply proves in the dog's mind that it is correct to be concerned. I much prefer the adding of tasty bits to the bowl and then going away to allow the dog to eat in peace. Over time the dog will come to look forward to someone approaching and the problem will be solved without battle. (you will find that in the archieves also).

There are also a host of ideas to handle resource guarding that do not involve a battle nor isolating the dog. Barry offered you some, I also use the fetch and trade, as opposed to the person approaching the dog with a trade item. This has an even stronger effect on the dog's mind and emotions as well as teaching something new - the fetch. Done with an unequal trade (what you have is even better) it is a non-hostile method of teaching the dog to relinquish with trust.

The difference is also, that the average pet owner has worked with the dogs s/he owns and developed techniques for those dogs. The good trainer has not only worked with hundreds and knows one size does not always fit all, usually has a wider range of suggestions and knowledge of the different character and behavior issues and the different techniques that are most appropriate and effective.

What you are experiencing is fairly common and should be able to be peacefully resolved for everyone's benefit. The advice you had received was also standard and more than acceptable which is why you didn't see any of us training nuts jump in. I did however want to address the idea that those of us who chose to invest more of our time, energy and yes - we also invest our money in education were wasting our time here.

[nmbr1mom57]

I would not ever suggest that a trained person would be wasting their time. I merely state that one does not have to be a professional to have a good unique idea. I also do not suggest that trainers are in it ONLY for the money. There is obviously an extreme love of dogs involved in having this as a profession. However the word professional indicates being paid for work done, it's very different from an amateur. As in sports for instance, where the professional is paid and the amateur is not. In both instances they are very likely equally good athletes. The professional is likely to have more well-rounded experienc

I consider myself just an average Joe owner even though I volunteer at one of our local shelter and spend lots of time with all different types of dogs and cats. It's kind of sad, but I love to do it all the same. I don't think that because I'm not a professional I have no valuable information to offer someone else. I don't have all the different peoples names to reference or specific names of techniques, etc., but I do feel I know something about pet ownership and I hope to share anything I do know to in the off chance it may help someone else.

As I stated before helpful suggestions are greatly appreciated no matter who they come from. I value reading them all. And I will try the fetch idea. I haven't heard that one yet. I just want the behavior to stop whatever avenue it takes to get there.

[Habs]

The problem that you are having is extremely serious, in my regular Joe, opinion.

Your girl does not respect you, certainly does not feel subordinate to you, or at the least not to the degree that is needed.

The mondane training that is often ignored, will instrinsically, remove most if not all of the problems that you have, or may have in the future. Because remember small problems will difinitely become big problems as your Girl matures and becomes more confident.

I firmly believe that there is no magic trick that will change your dogs underlying dominence issue.
These quick fixes are like putting a bandaid on a bullet wound...addressing the symptom of the problem rather than the problem itself.

Bottom line: Go back to the training, show her in every scenario who's Boss, including other family members, especially your 7 year old.

"The best defence is a good offence"

Habs

[nmbr1mom57]

I absolutely agree with you Habs, it definitely can become a much more serious problem as she matures. We have worked with her enough (I began working with her well before posting this message) that she is not a threat when she is fed anymore. Our issue now is really just with "special" treats, those that cannot be scarfed down in one gulp. Barry and Judy both had great ideas about how to give these high value treats.

I reason for posting here is to address this issue completely while Inki is small so that I don't have a more serious problem later. Thanks for the thoughts:D

[TLR]

I don´t have any experience with food aggession, I don´t even have a dog, yet :-) But this what I would try:

Grab the empty bowl, put a small amount of food in it and feed the dog while holding the bowl. Repeat and gradually lower the bowl and reach for the dogs leg/side to pet her. Any sign of aggression => "NO!" and dinner is over.

[Muckdogs]

Having read only your original post and not the follow up comments, here's my suggestion which worked for me and some others I know.

Hand feed every other day and then on the off days, hold the bowl on your lap and allow your dog to eat from the bowl. SLOWLY, exert a little control vis-a-vis making the dog sit/down/stay before giving more food.

You have got to make the dog understand that YOU and you CHILDREN are the only reason that it gets fed in the first place and that eating is not a right, it is a privilege. Behave, eat, behave, eat.

I for one, put up with a little food guarding because we don't have any children, he eats alone and there is no reason to screw with him during mealtime, he has worked and earned his right to a peacful meal. But, that doesn't apply to your situation. Start exerting some control and ranking.

As far as the treats, those are a privilege as well, not a right. Maybe, for your girl, treats should be a crate only thing. Hard to say. Maybe she jsut ahs some bad manners right now. What I don't agree with, if any of the other posters have said this, is that you shold continually interfere with treat time. If the dog earns it, let it have it in peace, uninterrupted. I, for one, don't get a rush out of knowing that I dominate my dog at any time and take away something he has duly earned.