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Originally Posted by moondog  I'm not the one with a closed mind to new and IMPROVED methods, dear. Some of us simply choose not to move backwards in our training. |
So you consider a choke NEW and IMPROVED? Actually, I do believe chokes existed before squirt bottles were invented. You can trace a choke collar back to ancient Egypt. You can't get any more 'backwards in training' than that.
Seriously, read before you preach. Seriously. Anyone with access to a library can prove you wrong.
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I'm not sure I understand why you would want your dog not to know the aversion was coming from you.
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Because I want it to remain an aversion as opposed to a punishment. The entire theory behind operant conditioning is that punishments don't work unless they are severe enough to terrify the subject....and even then they work poorly. This is why we still have people filling up our prisons despite stiffer sentencing and why people on this board are constantly insisting that their dogs would 'run things if given half the chance' if they didn't utilize methods that cause their pets pain. Of course they chaulk this up to 'dominance theory' (Which is so incredibly outdated, it's laughable) as opposed to problems in their training technique.
But rather than just go on and on about the ins and outs of operant conditioning, I'll instead point you in the direction of the information and if you're so inclined, you can take a look at it yourself.
Read anything you can get your hands on by Ian Dunbar (Pretty much invented operant conditioning), the Brelands (They've also put together some really great videos about the history of operant conditioning and how it works...'Patient like the Squirrels' is a good starter). Karen Pryor also manages to really lay the method out in laymans terms in her books.
Furthermore, I'm 100% sure that these people know just a LITTLE bit more about dogs than Moondog.