Quote:
Originally Posted by moondog  Certainly....a GOOD trainer has many ENGAGING tricks up their sleeves. By using a spray bottle for puppy biting, many potentially positive and constructive training lessons are lost. Engaging a biting puppy using redirection and rewards for a wide variety of alternative behaviors can establish a truly solid desire in a developing puppy to want to work with you. All a spray bottle does when used as an aversive is mentally push the dog away from you. All you're doing is telling them to shut up. That's old school, and precisely the one trick pony you're talking about. Training has evolved, now people just need to evolve with it. FOR the dogs!  |
Actually, the entire use of prongs, chokes, and shock collars are now considered 'old school.' Much more old school, in fact, that a spray bottle full of water. Generally, you wouldn't use ANY aversive methods if you plan on going balls to the wall with the operant conditioning.
Hey, I'm all for evolving and educating and learning new theories. Which is why in the past 6 months alone, I have attended lectures and seminars of some really well known trainers and behaviorists. However, I just can't abide by the theory that the aversive methods one is used to and has used on their other dogs are 'OK' and another one is 'Oh my God, terrible! You're going to scare your dog!' It's a kind of hypocrisy in the dog world, if you ask me. Luckily enough, it's not that COMMON of an attitude in the dog world from what I've seen so far.
I mean, think about it. What do you think is more likely to mentally push your dog away from you? Wetting his butt with a little water? Or CHOKING HIM around the neck with a METAL CHAIN? What do you think he'd fear more? A little dribble of water? Or a freaking electric shock?
It's common sense which method is more 'aversive.' And if you're going to use aversive methods, you might as well learn how to use them ALL effectively. Remember, most people heavy into operant conditioning don't believe in aversive methods at all. Not winning the treat or the praise is considered the the 'aversive.'
Positive punishment, as a whole, is considered 'traditional' or 'old school.' ALL methods....not just a spray bottle.
Much like my politics, I'm pretty middle of the road when it comes to training. In most cases, I think operant conditioning works the best. But I'm not going to totally dismiss traditional methods if my dogs is just not getting any other way.
Hey, if you want to spend your time redirecting EVERYTHING for months on end because that's how you've always done it and it works for you, go ahead. Like I said, as long as it's humane and it works, generally, I think it's a positive. However, I'm not going to waste valuable time I could be spending training my dog in different areas because I'm too busy shoving a toy in her mouth every 5 seconds. Besides, what's the difference carrying around a toy for a few weeks or carrying a squirt bottle?
All I know is my relationship with my dog never suffered with a squirt bottle and she did quit nipping. I will say that after using a prong on my girl, she DID develop a certain dislike for walking on a lead though.
Every dog is different, I guess.