[BarryMcD]

amyryan:

I agree with Jamie & Odin that to help you in any specific way we would all need to hear more about the growling, when it started, where she does it (at home, outside, etc.), how she reacts if you do correct her, how you correct her, does she do it for all strangers, dogs too, etc.


> niche wrote: Now, for people aggression I would
> suggest having all kinds of people throw her
> treats BEFORE she growls. That way she associates
> strangers with treats instead of a threat. If
> she does growl you should correct her to let
> her know it is unacceptable.

This is a good method if you want to prevent her from growling in the future at strangers who throw her treats before they approach! ;)

Although I myself suggested having a few people toss her a treat, I would not make this the entire training method. Niche is right that you MUST have the person throw the treat BEFORE she growls, which means the person will still be at a "safe distance" as far as the dog is concerned. I'll bet you, though, that as soon as the treat is devoured, if the person takes a few steps closer into the dog's discomfort zone, the dog will growl as usual.

This method, used extensively, would fail for two reasons. First, the fear or aggression that dog feels toward the stranger is probably 100 times stronger than any gratification she will get from a dog biscuit! (It's like me giving you a dollar to calm you down before I blow up your house!)

Second, the reward could end up not coming entirely AFTER the desired behavior, which is when a reward must occur! For example, what if the stranger throws a nice juicy beef steak at the dog and the dog starts growling as the steak is hurling through the air or landing at its feet? (And this is likely because if the dog is spooked by a stranger just standing or walking, what do you think is going to happen if the stranger throws something at the dog?
(The more I think about this method, the less I like it. I now disagree with myself for suggesting it in my last post!)

Theoretically, YOU (the handler) should be rewarding the dog for good behavior with a treat (or whatever the dog thinks of as a reward). Ultimately, it doesn't matter if a stranger approaches with nothing, a treat, a stick, or a beard, hat, and bicycle: You want the dog to behave in all cases, and to do that you must convince the pup that A. You are the boss, B. It is always more rewarding and fun (and safe) to let the strangers approach, and C. It is always no fun to growl because the pup will be deprived of something it wants.

Now Niche and others come from a different discipline and type of training than me, Shutzhund, and I do not presume to know enough about that discipline to even comment on its techniques, but I do know that it is not a traning method that is appropriate in its entirity for family pets. Some of its techniques may translate well to a household environment and work, but over the past years the training of PETS has turned farther and farther away from leash training, verbal corrections, and positive punishments (where you say or do or add something to the dog's environment to make it stop), and modern trainers, supported by behaviorists and the newest understandings about dog behavior, have overwhelming moved to what could in general be called positive training methods. This is occurring with all animals, too, not just dogs.

These "positive" methods advocate fewer corrections, the use of strategies like silence, time outs, or ignoring the dog (all negative punishments--punishments that take something away from the dog rather than do something to the dog) as a substitute for conventional punishments and verbal corrections.

Separately but related, the great mass of research and evidence about dealing with aggression suggests that using any form of assertiveness, aggression, cohersion, physical discomfort, or dominating behavior to reply to growling, barking, and other unacceptable dominant or aggressive canine behaviors is absolutely the worst way to deal with them. In this case, fighting fire with fire will only set the house on fire!

Based on this, I would suggest that you do not verbally or physically correct the dog--except for using the leash to move the dog away from the person it is growling at and to maintain everyone's safety.

Instead, think of your dog growling at a stranger as the least important thing in the world. When it happens, just put distance between the dog and stranger until the growling ends. Pay no attention to it. So not say one word to the dog! Then, with the person still within sight, reward the dog for its good behavior as it sits and eyes the stranger without growling.

Then look at your job as a simple game with these rules: A) You want to ignore the bad behavior (give the dog no attention for it) bacause this in itself can be a REWARD for some dogs and may increase the behavior. B) You want to consistently reward good behavior. Look for opportunities. If a particular person does get nearer than usual without eliciting the growl, reward the heck out of the dog! C) Under controlled conditions, try to decrease the distance between the dog/stranger slowly. If the dog does not growl, reward it! If it does, turn and walk farther away and ignore the dog for a minute or two. Then try again. The key to success is repetition, repetition, repetition... and consistency. Try at first to reward every time the dog allows someone near. Ignore and walk the dog further away every time it growls.

Finally, there are several variables that may be making the situation worse and harder to correct.

1) DO NOT start this training in your house. The dog's territorial and protective instincts will be working against you.

2) Experiment with someone else who the dog tolerates holding the leash! See if the dog is better or worse if you are not near.

About a year ago, my wife owned a Rott mix that became extremely aggressive toward other dogs, even some in our own 5-dog household. We worked all the techniques I knew, with my wife holding her dog on leash, but nothing seemed to work. Then I realized one day what the problem was: my wife! We were trying to desensitize an aggressive dog by having the person it loved, protected, and was most loyal to hold the leash and stand behind it as other animals approached her! Once I started to be the leash holder, the training worked fine! As a matter of fact, the second my wife left the room, the dog was better with no training! One reasons was that my wife was anxious and scared about the outcome, and this made the dog more edgy! Only later, after good progress was made, did we place my wife back at the other end of the leash. in a sense, this dog needed to be desensitized to my wife and her emotions, not the approaching dog.

If this is part of your problem, you can use alternate methods, like tie the dog to a pole or bench or something and get out of the immediate area, or stand in front of the dog as the stranger approaches. Or do walk-bys where a person just walks past the dog from right to left, then left to right. Reward when successful. Ignore when not. Decrease the distance of the person on the next pass-by if successful. You can still reward from a distance by tossing the treats, or have someone else reward. Also try approaching your dog WITH a stranger at your side. An interesting experiment!

By now, you should have the basic ideas. You can make up your own desensitizing exercises based on any variation of these ideas.

To conclude, back to the Shutzhund folks. They would probably not use most of the ideas I have mentioned, and may not even agree with the idea of using only positive rewards and negative punishments, but that is because, as I said earlier, they have different goals and a different relationship with their animals, and their animals are different from the average house pet Rottweiler.

What they do and their philosophies are appropriate for their sport. And it just happens that many of their methods are similar or the same as many "traditional" dog training methods, which are no longer in favor with many PET trainers. The methods used in a sport like Shutzhund or to train a police dog are done by knowledgeable trainers under controled conditions for specific reasons that relate to their goals. That does not mean that these same methods, used by a casual dog owner under uncontroled circumstances will work or yield the results you, as a pet owner, want.

The more positive-oriented and humane approaches (and I do not mean to suggest that Shutzhund is inhumane; not at all) are safer for you, have virtually no potential to hurt or aggrevate the dog or situation, and will yield very good results in most cases, with the added bonus of strengthening the bond between you and your dog in a distinctly positive way, without complicating your life with mind games about who's the Alpha, dominance, pack order, etc.

"Dogs cannot be bad, they can only be dogs."
Barry